Home » Uncategorized » May 11, 2013 – Open Thread

May 11, 2013 – Open Thread

George eagleAnyone wanting to discuss the George Zimmerman case, you have come to the right spot. I’d appreciate you sharing information that could help move the case to the goal of a full accounting of the truth.  Thank you to “Captain Long” for the photo.

In yesterday’s thread, you will find discussion about the  Defense Reply to State’s Response and the Defense Reply to Crump’s Response.  Now we await the decision of the higher court on whether or not they will allow Mr. Crump to be deposed by George’s legal team.

If you haven’t submitted a vote, please do so and let us know your prediction.

For newcomers please know that racist remarks will be trashed and not posted.  If you are presenting yourself as a George Zimmerman supporter, please keep in mind this man is in a fight for his life.  Conduct yourself in a way that won’t bring more heartache and/or embarrassment to the Zimmerman family.

Thankfully all posters here have done an amazing job with posting.  Every comment submitted to this site has been posted as is. I may have to lay the moderator off due to lack of work.  Great job everyone!

If you’d like to share something privately, you can email me at nettles@bell.net

For those who can, please use the link at the top of the page to make a donation, to give the legal team the means to fight the injustice we are witnessing.  Thanks for helping.

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126 thoughts on “May 11, 2013 – Open Thread

    • This is proof of the success of this blog. It is as if some folks wait until midnight to race here and be FIRST. Not really race but I think you know what I mean. Over 2000 comments and no bad guys. That is astonishing.

      With the exception of minpin and bori, we all get along every one else behaves. (insert symbol for humor)

      Slowly, others from other blogs are finding us. We don’t dare invite them here at their current homes but like me, I think some of them are trying to run down Nettles after she “left” the TH. I found her at DMan’s and like others nudged/hinted for her to start her own deal w/o offending anyone there.

      Think about what I have said which clearly shows the respect she commands.

        • If you mean, “Are we living in an Urban Jungle Society?” the answer is yes, and your commentary, as usual, is outstanding.

          I have read other articles about the case and was skeptical of those studies, but I had always wondered if 38 people watched that happened so I learned something new. Thank you.

          • Thanks, when I first heard the tape with the screams on it, I immediately thought of the Kitty Genovese case. Imagine how different a result had GZ not had a gun to defend himself, or had it been a woman instead of GZ.

            This case has managed to turn everything upside down, now they want to investigate NW programs. It seems we have given up, crime has won,

            • “now they want to investigate NW programs”

              ^ THIS is what is really disconcerting to me… folks are essentially calling NW volunteers ‘stalkers, ‘busy bodies’ and ‘snitches’ who need to be beaten, sued, and prosecuted if they observe a stranger behaving suspiciously in the community and dare to report it.

              It’s bad enough that the ability of the police to protect citizens has been severely compromised by claims of profiling, but now even the ability of citizens to patrol their own neighborhoods and protect themselves from crime is coming under attack…

              • All based on lies, communities like those in Chicago are suffering but we are giving any that may try to help the wrong message.

                It is bad enough that there is enough peer pressure that prevents people from talking to cops, “snitches get stitches” but those that are still willing now have to content with being the target of the police themselves.

              • When Sybrina worked for the dept. of housing in Miami Dade, it was posted right on their website that neighborhoods needed to get involved with NW programs. They were looking for volunteers. Little did anyone know at the time that Sybrina herself, with a lot of help of course, would help to destroy those very same programs. Hasn’t Michele Obama herself promoted the “if you see something, say something” programs. Because of the George Zimmerman railroading, no doubt there will be many more that will see a lot, but will say nothing.

      • “Thankfully all posters here have done an amazing job with posting. Every comment submitted to this site has been posted as is. I may have to lay the moderator off due to lack of work. Great job everyone!”

        • Actually there is NO moderator to lay off. We are self moderated.

          I find it curious that some sites have so many mods and admin staff. I also notice that those sites are so closely moderated, it’s hard to post without sensing that someone is “looking over your shoulder” and it is not easy to find a comfort zone to express one’s self freely.

          Several come to mind but the HuffPost is notorious for the mod treatment of conservatives who post there.

          • The Huff Po ‘moderation’ criteria seems to simply be that if a post is flagged enough times it will be automatically removed… too many perfectly acceptable posts are removed far too often to believe that there is an actual live person reviewing the flagged posts to see if they really are offensive or abusive.

  1. Much of the content of the 3 documents the defense filed with DCA was almost identical so the court really should not need much time to make a decision.. NLT than Wednesday and maybe even as early as Monday.

    If common sense applied, this should be a done deal for the defense but sadly, both that and logic left this case long ago.

  2. Someone over at Free Republic says that the Francine Oliver mentioned in this article is the mother of Natalie Jackson. Anyone know if that’s true? Note that she’s concerned that potential black jurors will eliminate themselves by being honest about their thoughts on the case.

    BUZZ BUILDS OVER JURY NOTICES FOR GEORGE ZIMMERMAN TRIAL: http://www.baynews9.com/content/news/baynews9/news/article.html/content/news/articles/cfn/2013/5/10/buzz_builds_over_jur.html?cid=rss

    Oliver, who led protests last year pushing for Zimmerman’s arrest, said she wants a fair trial for both sides. She said even people with strong opinions about the case can consider both sides at trial. She worries some potential jurors are going too far.

    “Don’t get eliminated before you even get a chance to be questioned. We definitely don’t want it to the point that all blacks are eliminated because we got over excited and blew our chances. At least give us a chance. Give yourself a chance,” said Oliver.

    Oliver even posted a notice on her own Facebook page, advising people of what not to do if you get a summons.

    “Just kind of calm down, keep our mouths closed, take your envelope, report to wherever they tell us to report,” said Oliver.

    • There is a trail that associates “Francis Oliver” as the mother of Natalie Jackson. I don’t know from source documents (birth certificates, adoption records, etc.), but see Trayvon Martin Case Recasts Century-Old Battle Lines For Local Activist, HuffPo, March 18, 2012 for a reference, where the reporter attributes a mother-daughter relationship assertion to Francis Oliver.

      Francis Oliver, 68, a longtime activist and historian in Sanford, Fla. … Of her daughter Natalie, Oliver said, “I raised her on the front lines of the movement.” …

      “This is not the first thing that we’ve had to deal with,” said Oliver, an activist and historian whose daughter Natalie Jackson is an attorney for Trayvon Martin’s family.

      • It’s always bothered me that when the press prints about the Trayvon Martin Memorial, that they don’t tell the readers it was Natalie Jackson’s Mom is the source behind all that. They quote her all the time but never tell readers she is related to one of the attorneys.

        I wrote Jeff Weiner at the Orlando Sentinel about it when he failed to mention the fact. I got no reply and have noted at least one other article written by him that once again failed to tell the relationship.

        Readers have a right to know about potential biases. It doesn’t mean there is one but let each reader determine that. To not mention the relationship when quoting Ms. Oliver about the case is dishonest, imo.

        I’ve also read that Velma Williams is Natalie Jackson’s Godmother. If indeed that is so, whenever telling us about Ms. Williams views on the case, that relationship should be highlighted too. http://www.sanfordfl.gov/index.aspx?page=82
        Ms. Williams is believed to have gotten the Mr. Crump and company the meeting with the Mayor with the help of the City Manager on March 16, 2012 in which they convinced the Mayor to release all the calls that night.

        • The press deliberately misleads. Its agenda is emphatically not truth, but manipulation and profit. The press never had and doesn’t have an obligation to tell the truth. That’s a fiction erected by the press in order that gullible people will think the press has an obligation to be truthful, therefore the press is credible, and is a bastion against assorted social ailments.

          If readers want to know, the first thing they have to do is stop being gullible. Fact of the matter is, most people have other issues in their lives, and don’t have the energy or mental capacity to get to the bottom of anything.

    • Francis Oliver, the curator of the Goldsboro Museum in Sanford is likely the mother of Natalie Jackson, if that Francis is around 69 years of age.

      She has also been referred to in the press (in the past) as “Goldsboro curator Francine Oliver” .

      http://articles.latimes.com/2012/jul/10/nation/la-na-nn-memorial-trayvon-martin-20120710

      Whether this Francine is the Francine with a connection to the the W8 letter is speculation.

      Since W8 seems to be located in the Miami area, at the outset, it would be less likely that a civilian Sanford-based individual would be thusly involved at this level of detail.

      Secondly, it is not likely that the mother of Natalie Jackson would be involved in helping this key witness when her daughter was far more competent in these particular matters and is directly connected with the case.

      It should be noted that Ms. Oliver vetoed attempts by some individuals to have the Goldsboro Museum in Sanford house a memorial of sorts to Trayvon Martin.

      • Natalie wouldn’t directly associate herself with composing Witness 8’s statement. It’s more likely that a pseudo-outsider would.

        I do agree that it is speculation that Francis/Francine Oliver, curator of a black historical museum in Sanford, mother of Natalie Jackson, and activist in criticizing SPD in its handling of the Martin death, is the person West identified as Witness 8’s friend, Francine. But the pieces that make that case, fit together very well. The defense said that it knows who this person is, so there is a chance the public will learn, too.

        • I couldn’t help but notice she spells her name in the male form. Frances is the accepted spelling for a female. At first I thought it was a typo, but this is how it is spelled on the museum site and several articles quoting her. No big deal, just thought it odd.

        • cboldt – I think you are spot n thinking NAT Jack would possibly be smart enought to have someone else locate the “writer” of the letter s she could deny it.

          NAT Jack, Crump, Tracy, & Sybrina weren’t SMART ENOUGH to realize the Defense wasn’t going to take their word about the IMAGE they created on TM. Sybrina has been confronted by the lies of the TM that never was even having to admit to all the suspensions, but they continue to lie alot, about alot of things.

          I think Robert Jr. was absolutely correct, the MEDIA is spineless & doesn’t ask the questions that need t be answered about WHERE TM was living when he died even though Aunt Ebony has shared, WHERE TM spent most of his formative years. I BET MOM/West know those answers.

      • “Since W8 seems to be located in the Miami area, at the outset, it would be less likely that a civilian Sanford-based individual would be thusly involved at this level of detail.”

        W8 didn’t know Francine’s last name. Because NatJac is directly involved in the case, and is a Martin family attorney, she knew better than to directly get involved with W8 as she could have been directly tied to coaching and tampering with a witness. NatJacks mother brought some distance between the family attorney’s and the witness. Francine Oliver has long been an intolerant of other races activist. That makes it more likely that it would be Francine Oliver than not.

        Hopefully the defense asked W8 for a description of Francine, where and when they met, and how long they had been friends etc. I have a feeling the defense knows exactly who Francine is, and at some point most others will as well.

          • That’s my understanding as well. I thought I heard Mr. West say that at first W8 didn’t know much about the friend who helped her write the letter and who had “escorted” her to Jacksonville in August. I’ll listen to the hearing again to make sure.

            It’s also very telling to me that BDLR didn’t answer Mr. West’s question on when he found out about the letter. In court, he talked about actually seeing the letter for the first time when Sybrina Fulton pulled it out of her Bible, but that doesn’t answer the question when he found out about the letter.

            If, indeed Francine “escorted” W8 to Jacksonville to meet with BDLR and others in August of 2012, it’s hard to believe that Francine’s role in helping W8 write her “letter” wasn’t discussed.

          • During DD’s partial depsition, ALL either MOM or West had to do was pull up a photo of Francine Olivier from the internet for DD to make an ID.

            I bet that’s how they know, BET BDLR pooped in drawers, yet AGAIN!

        • If, indeed, it is “Francine” Oliver, mother of Natalie Jackson, who advised and aided W8, it is another monumental screw-up on the order of Mr. Crump and his faulty tape recorder.

        • I have no idea why my above comment wound up in moderation. Every time I sign in to WordPress, I use the exact same information that I’ve used from the beginning when signing up. Originally I used the name minpin06, but later changed it to pinecone (minpin). I have no idea why WordPress, on it’s own, picks the name they will sign me in as at any given time. I suspect that the posting name change caused me to be in moderation, as my comment was very similar to cboldt’s. Sorry for any trouble that may have caused you Nettles.

          • I was trying to figure it out as well. The only time a comment needs to be moderated thus far is when they are posting for the first time. WordPress picked you up as a first time commentator. No worries, it’s no work to approve the comment.

              • I still remember when many folks were kicked off. When they tried to sign in, their user name had been taken by someone else. We all had to change.

                I was and still am jordan2 at all sites except for WP. jordan2, 22, and 222 were all gone. So that is why I am jordan2222.

                  • By the way, Nettles, the site seems to be taking me directly to my reply after I post it now. I’m not sure if you changed something or if maybe it just starts acting oddly after there are a lot of posts.

                    • Thanks for the feedback. I don’t think it was b/c of my doing. I find that feature comes and goes on most of the WordPress sites. I have learned not to touch anything right after posting because the redirect takes a second after the post. If I move the mouse or touch a key, I interrupt the redirect. However, even then sometimes it doesn’t work.

                      I’ve emailed WordPress support with our observations.

                    • I’ve noticed that too. If I try to scroll down before the refresh finishes it screws up returning to where I just posted. I have to wait until the spinning stops completely.

                    • I’ve emailed WordPress support with our observations.

                      This is great news. 😀

            • That’s interesting Jordan. I had never signed out of WordPress but every so many days it would sign me out automatically, and I had to sign back in. I’ve done that many times and never had any problems. My posting name always came up as pinecone (minpin) when I signed back in using the same user name and password every time. Over the past few days, I have had to sign back in at least once a day. Somehow it reverted back to my posting name when I first signed up for a WordPress account when the CTH required an account to post comments about a year ago. Over the past few days I’ve also been getting an influx of emails from people, groups and organizations I’ve never heard of or had any interest in. I haven’t opened any of the emails, I just delete them.

              What is the difference between WordPress and gravatar . com?

              What “bad things” are you referring to if you sign out?

              • Clearly, we all have different experiences with WP. You have a complex username that is not likely to be wanted by others.

                Gravatar refers to your avatar. It’s right beside your name. You can change it if you like.

                My “bad” experiences are too complex to explain in a post but over time, I have learned a lot of solutions. I subscribe to ALL threads that interest me so I get every single post in a Yahoo email account. It works for me as I have explained in detail previously, including how to manage it.

            • jordan2222 – LMAO! Your right about “bad things happening,” I too have shared your experience and have verry little patience in trying to resolve them.

              • I have had many issues over the years. I am now self taught but learned how to fix them and also how to avoid them . I am no expert at all but I know what works best for me. More “fixes” and info are now available but there was a time.. well forget it.

                I accept that multiple browsers are required for this site as well as using the zoom feature, but I can do it seamlessly now.

                Try other browsers. You might be amazed at the differences.

                I currently use both Firefox and Safari for Mac. Sadly, Opera will not currently allow me to access Yahoo email but I liked Opera.

      • Imagine the rage if you read this with one minor change:

        “Don’t get eliminated before you even get a chance to be questioned. We definitely don’t want it to the point that all WHITE PEOPLE are eliminated because we got over excited and blew our chances. At least give us a chance. Give yourself a chance.”

        • She is encouraging black people to not be forthcoming in their views in order to get a chance to sit on the jury. That’s intolerable.

          What’s wrong with encouraging everyone and I mean everyone to be honest and forthcoming on their views and decision making abilities and let the lawyers and judge decide who among them can be the most objective in hearing the evidence in the case? (rhetorical question).

          Her daughter stands to earn a lot of money if she can get tainted jurors in the box.

          • Equality and justice for all is selectively applied by many so called black “leaders.”

            She is actually telling blacks HOW TO THINK, implying that they do NOT know how to do that. Good God almighty!!!

          • That is more than intolerable. She is in essence telling any potential black juror to lie just so they can get on the jury to insure that GZ is convicted despite the evidence. I wonder if the defense team is aware of the Oliver statements. Someone in a local community, telling local potential jurors to lie in order to get on the jury has got to be illegal.

            As Jordan indicated, if a white person made those statements to potential jurors, to lie just to get on the jury to free GZ, there would no doubt be a bounty put on their heads, and they would be run out of town.

            Yes Nettles, Natalie Jackson does stand to be able to steal a lot of money with a GZ conviction. Unfortunately there are those in Sanford that don’t understand that it will be there money that will go into Natalie Jackson’s pocket.

          • Nettles: She is encouraging black people to not be forthcoming in their views in order to get a chance to sit on the jury. That’s intolerable.

            You’re being too kind…

    • Wow. Sounds to me like she’s implying that all blacks are going to already have judged George guilty, and she’s encouraging them to be quiet about their beliefs long enough to get on the jury – because they can’t help convict him if they can’t get on the jury because of their bias.

    • Wow. Sounds to me like she’s implying that all blacks are going to already have judged George guilty, and she’s encouraging them to be quiet about their beliefs long enough to get on the jury – because they can’t help convict him if they can’t get on the jury because of their bias.

      I hope the defense finds out if she is the one who drove DeeDee to the interviews, and if she is the one who “helped” her write the letter. All the interference in the criminal trial by the future attorneys for civil suits is too much, and if the mother of one of those self-interested parties is also interfering in the “evidence”, it should be exposed. The state should never have referred to the “letter helper” as a friend of DeeDee if it was in fact the mother of Natalie Jackson.

  3. Glad to be here Nettles. Love a good debate, particularly for Zimmerman supporters, however, the 3 to 4 words per line is painful to read, for me at least. Anyway to turn the posts into a paragraph?

    • Hi! Welcome! Thanks for the feedback. The theme is limited. I’m sourcing other ones. I’m glad to have your perspective on the case. Thanks for participating.

    • 3 or 4 words per line sounds like you need to “zoom out” on the page. I zoom in and out as needed. Also, try another web browser, which I also do.

      At some point, I think Nettles might have to at least TRY a totally different theme, given all of the various issues many of us experience.

      • I wish WordPress would use up all of the available width of the user’s screen. My monitor is wide, and it’s terrible to have to see less than 15 words across on each line. That’s the real thing that makes it hard to navigate through these sites – and not just Nettles’ site. Maybe that’s something that can be accomplished through customization or a custom theme, but I have seen a lot of WP sites that are like that.

        • I have seen what you describe at other sites like CTH, but NOT here. I use a Mac. The posts and replies are are all stacked on top of each other in both Safari and Firefox.

          My issues are far different and I feel bad commenting about them. I will wait for changes but in the mean time I have learned how to use the site. It requires extra work and time but it works out for me.

          • I think WP reserves the space on the right for things a blog owner might want to put there such as a listing of recent comments, past posts, photos, etc. Busy blogs usually have comments far longer than those things, though, so whether a blog owner uses any of that space or not, the comments are limited in space.

      • CCG ~ I think your right, Francine is unusual & sounds like an old name imo, maybe a family name.

        As far as NAT Jack & Francine being mother/daughter: I live in the South & its common for non related black people to call those close to them or grew up with, or even raised by an unrelated person, god sister, god brother, “Auntie, Papa, Big Mama, sista, brother, etc. and the new one is “friend couisn.” (go figure) I assume it is meant as a type of endearment to claim closeness to the other person. (I worked in the school system, it was most confusing when a confidential document had to be signed)

        Wonder what TM called Alisha?

  4. It is my contention that one of the biggest showdowns of the trial will be when Norm Wolfinger takes the stand. BDLR will have to argue why Angela Corey’s team should be given greater credibility than Norm Wolfinger’s team who concluded that GZ had committed no crime at all.

  5. “This is not the first thing we’ve had to deal with” said Oliver, an activist and historian whose daughter Natalie Jackson is an attorney for Trayvon Martin’s family.”

    “I’ve been fighting white people my whole life seems like said Oliver. Of her daughter Natalie, Oliver said I raised her on the front lines of the movement.”

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/03/16/trayvon-martin-george-zimmerman_n_1352874.html

    Any more doubt? In some articles she is called Francis and in some she is called Francine.

    • Wild Bill, one of those “online extreminsts,” no doubt. People say the darndest things …

      “I think they’re doing the right thing to be proactive in case there is an emotional outbreak,” said Ray Sands, a central Florida resident.

      Stock up on the Kleenex.

      • “extreminsts (sic), you say?” Funny that..

        What would you call some of those “peaceful” (sarc) black groups or even those endorsed by Al, Jesse, Ben Jealous and THEIR kind ?

        It will take even more extremism to defeat their extremism just as we can only defeat terrorism if we learn to think like and be terrorists AND EVEN MORE SO THAN THEM. Viet Nam taught us that there are NO rules of war.

        I fully believe we created the hatred that the widely acclaimed bad guys have for us and/or at least greatly contributed to their increased LOVE for us (sarc) and it’s why I have always opposed being on the Arabian peninsula from the start. So, yes, I studied, followed and befriended Ron Paul when I first began to study Money and Banking and the FED before he was in Congress.

        When Bush et all conned the public and went into Iraq, I wrote some “papers” about how we will have to counteract the results of his illegal acts by first creating a Department of Terrorism or something similar. I used the name to make it clear to our newly found enemies who we were and that we can also respond with acts of sheer terror.

        Something scary happened and I destroyed all I had written and asked those who had received them in email to do the same. I have already had one really BAD experience resulting from the Patriot Act and recognize that I have always been somewhat targeted as a result of my top secret work with nuclear weapons long ago during my 4 years in the USAF.

        Specifically, I think I can finally now say, (I HOPE SAFELY) that I cannot discuss with any of my doctors some really awful things that needlessly happened during that era that resulted in my PTSD.

        Their solution: Therapy denied. Discussion not allowed. Drug the patient for life.

        Forgive the rant but you touched a nerve as I have become an “Angry White Man” and am also a disabled vet, dating back to the late sixties (Viet Nam and Cold War era) and oppose all unconstitutional wars as do almost all of my fellow veteran friends including my 89 year old Dad, one of the first Navy Seals (UDT back then) and highly decorated including a nomination for the Medal of Honor.

        For the history record, he and a handful of other UDT members were on the Normandy Beach for 2 days BEFORE the Allied invasion, trying to hide (unarmed) as they waited for the weather to clear.

        There now.. . I feel so much better.

        \

        • I posted a reply on that article. Not everyone who is going to be there is an extremist and not everyone that is going to be there is pushing for anything except to ensure GZ gets as fair a trial as possible. It’s my opinion too much has transpired to say he can get a fair trial. Secondly, the press needs a message that their reporting unsubstantiated comments made by Crump and Company is and was lazy and a miscarriage of their duty to bring truth to the public.

          As to Wild Bill, his video appears to be targeted to conservatives and if I read it right, he doesn’t think conservatives can be racist. He wants to send a message to liberal racists and the liberal racist media. That does sound extreme and one-sided to me. I like that he’s calling attention to the games that went on in this case. I don’ like that his message is so divisive. George Zimmerman supporters are quite a mixed bag. Name calling some of them, doesn’t help.

        • Sarcasm doesn’t work in an online communication. I was mocking the author’s use of the term “online extremists.” I’m sure the author’s vision of “online extremist” includes ONLY pro-Zimmerman personalities. More of the same reporting. I just block it out, it is so absurd and inane.

          • Sarcasm doesn’t work in an online communication.

            That is why I often add (sarc) in my posts unless it is some one who knows me well. You and I might be getting there and I know now to look for your “smart ass” remarks. LOL

            I cannot find a FREE sarc symbol in WP. Who buys a symbol that might even be more confusing?

        • For myself personally Jordan, and I only speak for myself, this blog is not about pushing one’s political positions in any shape matter or form. I personally find your post offensive, and using this blog as a soapbox to push your political agenda is likely offensive to many.

          I’m not glad that you fell so much better for getting your inappropriate rant off here on these pages, as an “angry white guy.” Hopefully you can find relief for your anger elsewhere.

        • “It will take even more extremism to defeat their extremism just as we can only defeat terrorism if we learn to think like and be terrorists AND EVEN MORE SO THAN THEM. Viet Nam taught us that there are NO rules of war. ”

          I believe you put yourself on every terror watch list that exiss in this country buddy. It would be well deserved.

          Jordan you do realize that you have now put this entire site on a watch list because of your rant, right.

          Nettles, it would be well advised if you delete the post by Jordan. We will al be considered terrorists by association with this post.

          It is a disgusting post. It is reprehensible. It drage everyone else here into the muck and mire.

          I want nothing to do with this position.

          This does much more harm to George Zimmerman than it could ever help him.

          This will be no doubt picked up by Bernie as the “extremist faction” that is supporting George Zimmerman.

          Nettles, I beg of you to delete that post. Please God in Heaven delete that horrid disgusting post.

    • Doubt he has 10,000, but Jordan? Why would you want to see something like that? You do know where he is headed, right? You almost sound like you would enjoy seeing a race based fight, like it is something you want ring side seats for.

      • I think maybe I should keep my views about this limited to those who know me well enough to understand what I am trying to say. Clear PRECISE communication is difficult on blogs and in email. One huge issue is the use of sarcasm

        There is no universal symbol for it like a smiley. 😀

        I have seen 4 but you have to pay for them and who would even recognize it as a symbol for sarcasm?

        I sometimes type (sarc) after a sentence but sometimes my entire post is sarcasm. Some, like Nettles and jello. for 2 examples, recognize that, while others may not. There is also another poster here who frequently uses sarcasm and it is so well disguised that I have had to learn that about him. Maybe you have seen some of our exchanges about HIS use of sarcasm. He is knowledgeable and I have grown to respect him as well as think of him as a new friend.

        I have a dry sense of humor (the English/Scottish in me) and use a lot of sarcasm. It is who I am . I try to speak my mind and what I would say in face to face comments.

        Doing that can be misunderstood as you may have noticed at another site. I will not apologize for being me and none of us should ever do that. I NEVER intentionally disrespect anyone.

        This is the best answer I can give you.

  6. Both of George Zimmerman’s lawyers are “Board Certified”. I looked up what that means in the State of Florida. I’ve learned that only 6% (4,300) of lawyers in Florida hold this title and George Zimmerman has 2 of them! This is the highest level of an evaluation a lawyer can attain. Both Mr. O’Mara and Mr. West are Board Certified.

    http://www.floridabar.org/TFB/TFBResources.nsf/Attachments/2238C54383A817FB85256F730057158B/$FILE/Certification%20One-Pager.pdf?OpenElement

    Awards Banquet in June
    http://www.floridabar.org/TFB/TFBResources.nsf/Attachments/6A8E4D175083E14E85257B64005A1C7B/$FILE/reception%20invitation%20-%20final.pdf?OpenElement

    • I think maybe board certified in death penalty cases might be a smidgin’ higher. You do know what a smidgin’ is, right? 😀

      However, Nelson obviously must have an even higher evaluation as she demonstrates at each hearing with HER interpretation of law.

        • Insulting? She is Canadian. MANY people ask me what that means. Sorry, minpin, but did you notice that I also covered that by inserting a smiley face. At least, that was my intent.

          I do not know what you mean by this:

          Why have you gotten so insulting, political, and egregious.

          When have I been insulting or “conspicuously bad or offensive?”

          Are you trying to pick another fight? I had thought you were through with that.

          • You know what Jordan, I don’t adjust, alter, or conform my opinions based on what a particular website, or particular moderators will or won’t accept as appropriate commentary, based on their own pre-conceived notions, or the boss in charge. That’s exactly why I told the mods at the CTH to hit the road. Conform or else, and you have successfully done that. My opinion doesn’t depend on where I am posting, what is allowed or not, or what the general consensus of a site owner, or moderators demand. My opinions, thoughts, ideas, philosophy and political positions belong only to me. I refuse to be lead by the nose based on who will like me based on what I have to say. Despite your political philosophies, which you have shared in abundance here tonight, I am a much more free thinker. I don’t pander and/or scream to be “liked,” or paid special attention to. If my comments have been inappropriate, Nettles can ban me any time she chooses to. BTW, were you the one that sent emails to the CTh when I was still posting there complaining that I was a bully, which in turn resulted in CTH emails to me telling me that someone was complaining that I was more or less a bully? I resented the emails I had gotten from the CTH, no name from anyone there mind you, and no name of who was complaining about me.

    • Nettles.. maybe I am losing my mind so please help. Didn’t you post this before and didn’t I send a detailed response?

      Changing subject…..

      Today, after all of mine and other poster’s discussion about WP and in particular the “staying logged in” issue, WP began to arbitrarily log me out, meaning I had to log back in each time (at least 3 times).

      This happened immediately after I had written lengthy replies to others here including a very long complimentary post about minpin. IOW, I was SUPPOSED to be taken back to my comment to confirm that it had posted.

      Much to my dismay, they all had disappeared. What I mean is that they never posted.

      What a bummer which confirms what I have said about bad things happening if you log out.

      changing subject again…

      This guy must be a secret admirer to follow you around so much. LOL…

      Nettles18? (none / 0) (#13)
      by Riddick on Fri May 10, 2013 at 04:25:00 PM EST
      Is this the famous nettles of the treehouse?

      Is he the resident clown at talkleft?

      • Nettles has absolutely nothing to do with logging you out of WP. I have posted WP comments on other sites and have been logged out, and had to log back in again, even when I wasn’t posting here on this site for several hours. I actually figured out what my problem was/is and it has absolutely nothing to do with anything Nettles has done or not done. I believe that you complained that Nettles simply changing the screen to a darker mose caused you problems with your incesant reply capabilites so you never have to visit the site. Would your using a proxy server be a part of your problem?

    • Nettles – I thought Jeralyn gave a good response and did clear some things up. imo, it seems BDLR has much bigger problems in his case that trying to get something out of Shellie.

      I read a comment by a TM supporter that stated “Shellie was in trouble for moving GZ’s truck & both the Prosecutor & defense knew about it.” WTF? TM supporters never have a link & haven’t understood yet that opinions & theories aren’t evidence of facts. I didn’t understand her comment, Shellie would have had to pick up GZ’s vehicle to park at their condo it seems, no reason to leave it parked at the scene once LE was through w/the investigation.

      • This article in the New York Times dated May 16, 2012 some errors the police made in doing the investigation was highlighted after their review. One of the mistakes they admit to making was not securing GZ truck as they wrongly thought he was on foot.

        At the top of page 3/4 they say “A law enforcement official said officers did not seize Mr. Zimmerman’s vehicle because they thought that he had been on foot. They did not realize that he had been driving until after his wife had moved the vehicle, the official said. ”

        http://www.nytimes.com/2012/05/17/us/trayvon-martin-case-shadowed-by-police-missteps.html?pagewanted=1&_r=0&ref=trayvonmartin

        Of course, Shellie isn’t in trouble for moving it. It was not secured by police. There is evidence of where the truck was parked as an officer ran the plate tag that night, hoping to find Trayvon’s vehicle, and the two plates he ran came back as one belonging to Zimmerman. From the police transmission audio that night we hear:

        (24:15) unintelligible Delta 28
        (24:21) Go ahead with your plate
        (24:23) Alpha Tango Tango 0 6 8
        (24:40)(apx. 8:30pm) unintelligible Honda unintelligible expires 6/19/2012
        (24:55) Thank You
        (25:03) 2312 Bravo
        (25:09) I’m sorry?
        (25:12) Run a tag for me
        (25:19) What’s the tag
        (25:21) Florida tag 816 Kilo Lima Papa, tell me if it’s registered anywhere in Twin Lakes
        (25:43) Zimmerman
        (25:46) Thank You

  7. Nettles – I missed all the original information on GZ’s vehicle, I guess I slept that week, thanks for filling in the blanks for me.

    BDLR thinks Shellie talked to some of the witnesses? What difference would that make, I would think Shellie would be upset, concerned, and trying to find out what happened. The problem was it would seem, there were only a few that really knew what happened, can’t you just see the crowd that had gathered and all the stories circulating as to the events that led to the shooting?

    I think Sanford LE is thrown under the bus no matter what, but how could ANYONE screw up bigger than BDLR/Corey? Crump interviewing DD first, holding a news conference claiming evidence to blow GZ’s self defense theory out of the water, interviewing DD w/Nat Jack there & Sybrina on one side of DD. LE prevented from interviewing DD FIRST & correctly recording her interview, Corey praying with the family, DD’s lying exposed, DD’s letter with held almost a yr. from the Defense for BDLR to find out during the Defenses depo of DD, Francine wrote it.

    imo, NO ONE could have made a bigger mess of this case than the State Attorney’s, apparently with the support of Bondi. jmho.

    • I agree. Did you hear the passion in Mr. West when he spoke of the lies and slander that was heaped upon the Sanford Police? Oddly, I think we are going to see the police team up with the defense in this trial.

      • Just as Mike McDaniel had said, “when the facts and the law are against you, blame the police.” He also said that everything in this case is upside down. It is usually the defense that are fighting the police investigation, but in this case it is the prosecution fighting them.

        As the lead investigator, I would think that Chris Serino’s testimony would be critical in the trial. No doubt that his admission to the FBI about being pressured to charge GZ will be brought up. His statements that everything GZ said about self-defense was adding up, shortly before he filed the capias, hopefully will be brought forward also.

        So that I understand correctly, was Serino’s capias necessary for the prosecution to move forward, with the charges they decided on? IOW, was it necessary for someone at the SPD to file the capias in order for the state to charge GZ, or could the prosecution have done it on their own without the SPD?

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