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July 20, 2013

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George Zimmerman Discussion Thread – Post Verdict

#

Sex

Age

Race

Family

P. Video Interview

D. Video Interview

Information/Comments

B29

F

40s

Hispanic

Married 10 years, 8 kids

B29 Prosecution

B29 Defense

Recently moved to central Florida from Chicago. She enjoys watching the “Real Housewives” on television and works as a nurse on an Alzheimer’s section of a nursing home. She said she hadn’t paid much attention to the shooting. She said she has been arrested, but her case was disposed of. It’s not clear why she was arrested or exactly what happened to her case, though she said she was treated fairly. She is married and has several children. A prosecutor described her as “black or Hispanic” during jury selection.
 

B76

F

50s

White

Married, 2 kids

B76 Prosecution

B76 Defense

Has lived in central Florida for 18 years. She manages rental properties with her husband of 30 years. She has two adult children, including one who is an attorney. She is involved with rescuing animals in her free time. During jury selection, she said she had been the victim of a nonviolent crime. “Everyone deserves a fair trial,” she said. The prosecutor wanted this juror struck.
 

B37

F

50s

White

Married 20 years, 2 kids

B37 Prosecution

B37 Defense

Volunteers rescuing animals. She is married to an attorney and has two adult children. She said she and her husband used to have concealed weapons permits. During the last round of questioning, she said she had an issue with the type of weapons people are allowed to carry. She also thought weapons’ training was inadequate for people seeking permits. “It should become harder,” she said. She has let her permit lapse.
 

B51

F

60s

White

Unmarried, no kids

B51 Prosecution

B51 Defense

Retired, not married and doesn’t have kids. She has lived in Seminole County for nine years. From Oviedo who has a dog and 20-year-old cat. She has worked in real estate and run a call center where she said she had experience resolving conflicts. When asked if Zimmerman did something wrong by following Martin instead of waiting for police, she said: “Yeah, I guess he did do something wrong.”
 

E6

F

20s

White

Married, 2 kids

E6 Prosecution

E6 Defense

Warned kids not to give “false impression” about themselves. A young white woman and mother who used to work in financial services. She used this case as an example to her adolescent children, warning them to not go out at night.Husband an engineer. Children are 11 and 13. Husband and son have guns. Victim of Domestic Abuse. Unemployed, volunteers at kids’ school. 2-year Seminole Co. resident, had lived in Orange Co. since 2004. Saw an innocent person go to prison. The prosecutor tried 3 times to get this juror struck.
 

E40

F

60s

White

Married, 1 son

E40 Prosecution

E40 Defense

Moved to FL from Iowa in Nov. 2012. She heard national-news reports and recalls the shooting was in a gated community and a teenager was killed. Worked as safety officer, husband is a chemical engineer. Son is 28. Was on jury 20 years ago in Pa. drug dealing case. She shared she has been a victim on a nonviolent crime. She describes herself as a football fan.
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61 thoughts on “July 20, 2013

  1. I’ve heard several commentators (Charles Krauthammer) say they saw Obama’s “speech” as a way of easing tensions because there would not be a civil case brought against George. I hope they are right.

    • dawndoe ~ I really respect Krauthammer, but I don’t agree w/him on this. Obama didn’t ease tensions imo nor was it his intention to do so, he only inflamed those with little knowledge on the case & validated the Professional Entrepreneurial Racist such as J Jackson & Sharpton. In essence, Obama has made this case, for the 2nd time about TM’s race, at first TM could have been Obama’s son, NOW, TM could have been Obama, what a travesty this Nation continues to be led by the uninformed.

      I have never been a Democrat, and never voted for one. I have liked & respected some of the Democratic Presidents in the past, I do not respect OBAMA anymore than he has DISRESPECTED GZ.

      Detroit is BANKRUPT & people have had their pensions diminished, Holder lied & covered up in “Fast/Furious” in the cartels getting guns & tried to hush the whistleblower, Obama claimed STUPID about Bengazhi & claimed he saw it on the “news,” the wiretapping of targeted Republicans but the Obama Administration said they “were sorry” even though the victims were targeted, NOW, Holder has FAILED to do anything about the IRS Scandal surrounding the White House YET Holder & Obama have involved themselves in the NOT GUILTY VERDICT of GZ. YET! Obama has done NOTHING on Black on Black crime NOR does he challenge the Race Baiters to address it even though they can’t make $$$$$ off the dead young men. jmho.

      imo, just a diversion so American’s question the reality of the scandal ridden White House.

      • I agree with you art.

        I do not think what Obama did was courageous from my vantage point is was incendiary and hurtful.
        Now the rioters will say Obama understand and sanctions or outrage. Obama’s comments ignore the Georg’es victimization and falsely suggested his suspicions were rooted in racism. Worse Obama speculated as to what TM thinks and feels and what motivated his resentments of George. I think he was wrong. I think TM thinks/acts more like a thug more than an aggrieved black teen frustrated by being perceived as suspicious.

        Perception versus reality.

        My reaction to Obama comments was hurt and fear. He made me more afraid of street culture violence. Just looking at my younger son life experiences with thug culture, he was victimized 4 x before the age of 17. All incidents were violent, committed by blacks who operated with the privileged of impunity granted them because there was an official resistance by the police to report/investigate/charge the crimes, except the last crime which happen in a neighboring city and the suspects were identified by my son. The gangsters involved in that crime are now the stars of an indie film made by Berkeley educated young people called Licks, it tells the story of an Oakland gangster after 2 year stint for robbery. The “stars” gave the film it’s authenticate look, they were just being themselves.
        I could go on for pages.

        For me Obama reminded me of what I have heard thousands and thousands of times about the great sins of racial profiling and he completely whitewashed and made invisible the pain and suffering black thug culture is causing individuals and society as a whole.
        I am deeply outraged and disturbed. How could I not be?

        if I missed an edit please ignore, just admitting these thoughts has me ill. I would like to feel their pain, but I am numb and angry at the racism Obama demonstrated by playing the whose pain is more real and the complete denial that TM committed a felony crime and is culpable for his death.

      • When the president talked about being suspected himself before he became a senator, I recollected back to when I was a teen and got followed through a department store by what I believed to be an undercover employee looking for shoplifters. The person made me uncomfortable and I left the store. Had I been black, I could have used that an excuse. More than likely, the store was experiencing thefts from teens and they paid extra attention to us when we entered the store. That’s common sense isn’t it?

        If I’m to understand their intent correctly, some like Piers Morgan think I would have had the right to lay an ass-whooping on the person who watched and followed me through the store. Is that really the message we want to send to teens?

        • I know, Nettles. It really irritates me when minorities, especially AA’s, complain about how they have experienced racism because they felt someone disrespected them when it actually had nothing to do with the color of their skin rather, it had to do with the content of the character of the person disrespecting them or the content of their own character. For example (true story):

          AA male: My white colleagues don’t like me because I’m black.

          AA female: Uh, noooo, they don’t like you because they think you are a jerk.

          This guy IS a jerk and his black colleagues don’t like him, either. He is lazy, condescending, incompetent and self absorbed. The problem is that he is black and he knows he is virtually untouchable. He gets transferred from department to department because the management say it is someone else’s turn to deal with him. Everyone has to take up for his slack. He is more often than not MIA and nowhere to be found.

      • Art and Cassandra,

        I can agree. On yesterday’s thread I stated, “I think, and I may be wrong, Obama is setting the stage for some sort of charge from the DOJ. I think George should leave the country.” That was my first impression. Now I just really do not know what to think. What i do know is that there shouldn’t be any fed charges and that the Obama should never have inserted himself into this situation. I share your utter disgust.

        • I am not sure what these means. This morn we watch the pres again, and now I am a bit more concerned, his comments about the facts of case were totally wrong, he repeated disinformation. Then he said reasonable doubt is relevant, relevant ?? I thought it was the basis for our criminal law. He next discussed his power to convene various agencies to look at the matter.

          I wish I never plug my nose and supported him, my first instincts about him proved correct and in fact worse.

          The Martins were hardly dignified, It is the Zimmermans who took the high road.

      • A poster named Judy over at the CTH wrote this:

        *****Found this post on Free Republic…..
        (Good plan,considering 75% of the country thinks the jury verdict was correct!) Read over Obama’s speech today carefully, and you find this gem: “I know that Eric Holder is reviewing what happened down there, but I think it’s important for people to have some clear expectations here. Traditionally, these are issues of state and local government, the criminal code. And law enforcement is traditionally done at the state and local levels, not at the federal levels.

        That doesn’t mean, though, that as a nation we can’t do some things that I think would be productive….”

        See what Obama did there? Lowering expectations – it’s a state responsibility, not the Federal Government’s – then quickly changing the subject before anybody realizes what has just been said.

        Of course, Obama & Crew will continue to milk the Trayvon trial for all they can, but talk of further “civil rights charges” will only be answered with “we’re still investigating the matter” from now on. The Black Grievance Society will of course be ticked, but what can they do? Vote Republican? Obama knows they’re not going anywhere, so he doesn’t have to risk any political capital for them!*****

        I guess this is the same reason Krauthammer said what he said about easing them into the possibility that there will not be a federal civil case brought against GZ.

  2. This is an good video to get the truth out in the Zimmerman Case. Great job American Thinker and Conservative Treehouse contributors. I disagree with the comment about getting out of car; but that’s minor.

    • FlaCracker is wrong and probably throwing more gas on the fire. There are quite a few thuggish white males in my community who have parents that respond very similar to that of Sybrina and just throw their hands up.

  3. There are several things that continue to bother me & I find terribly worrisome. Though West was a Federal Prosecutor, imho, West hasn’t made BIG money like MOM has since MOM was in private practice, West worked for the taxpayers at a fraction of the salary MOM made in private practice that doesn’t change the immediate problem of the Defense Team being able to move on in their lives & the practice of law for new clients. They need to be paid. “Licensing fees” can be paid for an interview IF NEW photos r NEW videos are supplied to the MEDIA outlet, in this case, the internet is flooded with available photos & videos. Though ALL the expenses have been paid for MOM/West to do the MEDIA Blitz, such as expenses, fine food, wonderful hotel rooms, all transportation while in NY & air fare, it is not a salary both men desperately need.

    imho, GZ is going to want to do an interview ASAP for $$$$$$$$$$$$$ which would be disastrous imho. Hannity is rumored to have donated $ 200,000.00 to GZ’s Defense Fund & that too covered GZ/SZ’s living expenses & body guards. The Defense has probably completely exhausted any monies left.

    I love GZ, I have tremendous respect for the entire family, but, imho, GZ doesn’t interview well, he isn’t warm & cuddly, or show remorse. Though some think GZ has nothing to “be remorseful for,” I certainly respect their opinion BUT anytime imho, a life lost is a sad event, & in this case,many that supported GZ’s innocence, thought GZ made many bad decisions as well as TM making many bad decisions. GZ doesn’t understand his flat affect when he speaks seems almost with out emotion. Until this charges or his has endlessly been coached by a professional, I hope he doesn’t do an interview.

    ALL JUST MY OPINION.

      • He did come back later in the Hannity interview and say he wished he’d never had to shoot Trayvon and that he prays for Sybrina and Tracy, but that never gets aired. I think he is religious but isn’t very well versed in the Scriptures so is conflicted with how he feels and what he “thinks” God’s plan is…what he’s been “taught” about what God’s plan is. I suspect he feels he shouldn’t really question why bad things happen and believes that God’s ways are higher than mankind’s ways. More could be said about that, but I’ll leave it there.

        I will say that George “seems” to be the type who doesn’t show much emotion or oftentimes keeps the really bad stuff to himself. I heard MOM say he told George to not show emotion and he may have taken that to the extreme. And RZjr mentioned that George is generally more subdued in nature. I have to go by how we’ll George is liked in the community and the fact that he is community minded. I think I would like George if he were my neighbor.

      • It’s ironic, RZjr is on right now talking about this very subject on Greta’s show. Thank God for DVR’s so I can rewind.

        Greta says GZ looks very unemotional and very flat then RZjr says, “well that’s how George is…He is very steady as you go, very responsible, very warm hearted and I think that anyone in that situation has to be very careful how they express themselves in front of the people who are gonna decide your fate.”

      • If I may add my 2 cents, I think the remorse part is being misunderstood. GZ saying he is not remorseful has more to do, that remorse is more indicative of guilt of having done something wrong. While yes it is possible to be remorseful without being guilty of something, I think the way GZ answered, combined with it was God’s will, just means that, he can’t feel remorse about something pre-ordained by God.

        A better question might have been if he is sorry, which he has already said he was. It matters not, cause anything he says would be turn around into a negative, he is in a no-win situation.

        • boricuafudd – remember the old saying, “always make the best first impression because you can’t undo it & it’s what people will remember of you?” Although I agree with you in trying to explain what GZ meant, we support GZ, imo, the damage has been done to GZ’s image, GZ has made his first impression.

          bori – What was your impression of the fear on the faces of MOM/West when they thought GZ was going to answer Judge Nelson? I think GZ wanted to testify, it was probably difficult, imo, for MOM/West to persuade GZ NOT to testify.

          • I saw mOM on an interview and he said George did want to testify but they strongly advised him not to do it. I’m so glad George listened. I was petrified for a while there.

          • You are right about first impressions, for many that did not see him on the stand at the bond hearing this was their first glimpse at the “monster” and he came out mostly favorable, imo, some of his statements gave ammunition for those against him.

            As for MOM/West it was panic, I don’t think they expected the judge to ambush them like that. It was totally inappropriate at that moment, and yes GZ definitely wanted to testify, that would have rescued the prosecution. Who was trying its darndest to force GZ to testify.

    • I think now that he is acquitted and once the trauma is reduced he was interview just fine. According the tweets of West’s daughter they described him as warm and loving.

      I think he should stay out of the spotlight for the purpose of taking care of himself and protecting himself from undue harm.

      • cassandra – the problem w/the opinion of West’s daughter, they are young & closer to GZ’s are BUT are they objective? I’m not about GZ, but I clearly see all the negatives GZ projects when he interviewed, did his re-enactment, his Hannity interview, the NEN calls, too, maybe it who he is. GZ’s interviewer wont be fun like the West girls are, GZ will be under a tremendous amount of pressure, every word will be criticized & scrutinized, questions will come at him in rapid fire & he will be challenged EXCEPT unless the interview is done w/Hannity.

        As much as I like GZ, he has a that flat affect that he had in the 911 call BEFORE the shooting, it may well be his personality, BUT all of us as GZ supporters would NOT BE GZ’s targeted audience, Those that are on the fence about who GZ is NEED to be convinced that he is a very likeable person. Even though he stated “he didn’t feel remorse,” he needs to show some sadness of the chain of events that happened that evening. GZ needs to project an emotional range of sadness as well as happiness in an interview, that is normal, most people have that range, I fear GZ doesn’t.

        Without repeatedly drilling & prep by a speech professional on GZ’s affect, I don’t think he will convince anyone of anything. THAT imo, would be the ONLY reason he should do an interview, to make a better impression than he has made in the past which is not favorable imho. Some supporters stated GZ appeared arrogant at times during the trial, I saw a frightened, unemotional, and probably medicated GZ during the trial & a few laughs & smiles but imo, he should have been given a pass on his behavior in Court, his freedom was on the line.

        Another problem for MOM/West, imho, GZ doesn’t get it! I think they feared GZ would demand to take the stand, HENCE, though it was wrong of Nelson to pressure GZ, you could see the fear on MOM’s face as well as West’s. GZ doesn’t see beyond possibly what he thinks, which is another problem, I have so much fear for any public appearances.

        ALL, jmho.

        • I agree, Art. GZ should NOT do any interviews. He just doesn’t come across well. I think his lack of remorse is that he isn’t sorry he saved his own life but he is sorry that it came down to having to take a life. He may even be resentful toward Trayvon for having attacked him and putting him in the situation of having to shoot and kill him. I see nothing wrong with that. I mean what type of person does what TM did to GZ? Not a very good one. IMHO. I feel bad that a life had to be taken, but I’m glad that it wasn’t the real victim’s life that was taken in this case. TM was headed down the wrong road and beginning to travel fast and it seemed that it was only going to get worse, especially with a gun involved in his future.

    • GZ should publish a book just like Robert Sr did. I’d wait a while, until then get GZvNBC and other law suits resolved.

  4. ANOTHER POTENTIAL PROBLEM that could happen is if MOM/West write a book. NO ONE would publish a book written by Jose Baez because KC’s verdict was so disrespected as was she, I think someone privately paid for Baez’s book to be published. Ashton promptly retired as a Prosecutor, wrote a book, a Lifetime movie was made, & did the MEDIA circuit over/over. Ashton was well loved by America for being the voice of Caylee & seeking justice for her murder. Ashton ran against his boss that made him OVERCHARGE w/the death penalty & beat him, NOW Ashton is too a State Attorney in Fla..

    I fear MOM nor West will make a lot of money off a book. WHY? Because it was an unpopular verdict, even KC wasn’t rioted against. Though I bought Ashton’s book & read it, MOST of the information was covered in trial r released through the Sunshine Laws or can be gotten now through request. Just as all of us that watched this case closely, MOM would need to produce a lot of new information BEFORE I would again buy a book on a case that I watched this closely..

    EVERYONE that participated in GZ’s defense DESERVE nothing but positive things to come their way especially monetarily & otherwise.

    What IF someone made a Lifetime movie from TM/Sybrina/Tracy/Prosecutor’s viewpoint & end the movie with the Jury saying “NOT GUILTY!” I wouldn’t doubt one bit this could happen, in fact, I fear it. Sybrina/Tracy have political conncetions as well as Hollywood supporting them, Hell, Sybrina is marching w/Beyonce & Jay Z tonight, Jay Z could finance the whole thing. Sharpton/J Jackson would play themselves. What a freaking nightmare that continues to grow.

    • IANAL but if a movie comes out I think it would be tagged as fiction and it would not say based on fact because I think George could sue. But everyone would know exactly what story was being depicted.

      • dawndoe – IANAL either, but most Lifetime movies are told from the perspective of the prosecutors whether they win or loose BECAUSE prosecutors speak for the “perceived victims.” Ashton, the Prosecutor lost KC’s case, but he wrote the book & the movie was made from the perspective of the losing Prosecutors, not from the perspective of KC who was legally found NOT GUILTY.

        TM’s story could be told from the perspective of Corey/BDLR/Guy, their theories presented at trial would be put forth in the movie. NEITHER the Defense nor the State knew who threw the first punch, the States theory is that it was GZ. Of course a movie would end with the fact that GZ was found “NOT Guilty,” but TM has become a martyr now for the uninformed & professional racist. TM could be made to look young & sympathetic buying skittles for Chad. None of what we know to be fact about TM’s drug use, suspensions, or who he was actually was would be part of the movie BECAUSE it was not a part of the trial.

  5. Nettles – I read up thread that Dershowitz said “GZ had a defamation suit against Corey.” BUT! I read last week, can’t remember where but Angela Corey CAN NOT be sued while she holds office, she is protected. Corey CAN BE sued once she leaves office, imo, hell would freeze over first or I would be dead before Corey retires. That is WHY, imo, we cannot find any lawsuits against Corey because she is in office, plenty of complaints but she has remained it appears, untouchable.

    Dershowitz said in another interview, Corey was PROTECTED ONLY if she was working in an official capacity pertaining to a case. Dershowitz said “Corey was NOT working in an official capacity because the case was over, the verdict was in, she offered her personal opinion in a National interview.”

    This stuff remains very complicated, but somethings got to give, it seems GZ would have a better suit against the Scheme Team, Sybrina/Tracy/Crump/Natty Jack for defamation but as luck would have it, Judge Nelson would hear the case as it would be a “Civil Suit,” Judge Nelson is now the “Civil Judge.” I hope MOM/West have a plan that will be put in MOTION whenever they are rested.

  6. George Zimmerman’s trial over, but legal fights aren’t

    Sanctions

    A debate over whether prosecutors should be sanctioned for allegedly failing to give defense attorneys damaging evidence from Trayvon’s phone provided some riveting moments just before the trial began.

    Defense attorney Don West was on the witness stand June 6 testifying about what happened and was being cross-examined by Assistant State Attorney Bernie de la Rionda, the lawyer West accused of malfeasance.

    “We caught you hiding the information and confronted you about it, and you never gave it to us,” West roared.

    Moments later, when O’Mara tried to call de la Rionda to the witness stand, the prosecutor refused.

    “Your honor, I’m not going to subject myself to … I think that’s improper; I object to it,” de la Rionda said.

    O’Mara then suggested prosecutors may have committed “direct criminal contempt,” prompting the judge to halt the hearing, move on to another matter and say she would take it up after the trial.

    http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/local/trayvon-martin/os-george-zimmerman-unfinished-business-20130721,0,1523006.story?page=1

    Proceedings remaining:
    1. SZ’s perjury trial (Criminal)
    2. GZ/MOM being sued over security team costs dispute (Civil)
    3. GZ / NBC Civil Suit (Civil)

    The article stated:
    Two other judges are overseeing separate civil cases spawned by the shooting, one by Zimmerman, who accuses NBCUniversal Media of defaming him, and one by his former bodyguards, who allege he owes them $27,000.

    Does this mean that Judge Nelson WON’T HEAR those cases? I pray she doesn’t.

    • I’m praying for that too Arttart. I heard Mr. O’Mara say that now the trial is over he may beef up his complaint about sanctions for the prosecutors. Today, I read that the affidavit may get challenged. Now that testimony is done and we see what evidence the state had before it, how can the affidavit allege pursuit, confronted.

      Also the affidavit tells the court that Sybrina identified the screams on the tape as Trayvon’s but doesn’t mention what Tracy initially said or what GZ’s father swore to.

      I read Mr. O’Mara has a deposition on August 28th for the security payment suit.

  7. Al Sharpton plays several sides in Trayvon Martin story

    Sharpton’s immersion in the story — unthinkable for a network-news figure even a few years ago — has raised questions for MSNBC and its parent, NBC News. Among them: Is Sharpton, and MSNBC, helping to create some of the very news MSNBC is covering?

    Still, Sharpton’s centrality to the Martin story “will make an interesting case study for a journalism ethics class,” said Lucy Dalglish, dean of the University of Maryland’s college of journalism. “Certainly, an activist has every right to communicate [his opinions], whether it’s on TV, or their own website,” she said. “Perspective in covering the news is one thing, but when it moves from perspective to activism and you’re actually one of the people driving the story you’re covering — that’s a little bit strange. There have got to be some people at NBC who are very troubled by this. Or there should be.”

    http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/local/trayvon-martin/os-al-sharpton-trayvon-martin-george-zimmerman-20130720,0,4056684.story

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