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Email Author II

email-integration-2 This thread has been developed to host a continued online discussion about the incident and circumstances of an anonymous sender of an email being sent to the treehouse, that had an impact on its’ owner Sundance.

We are NOT looking to find out who this sender is in the real life world, but who was it among us in their online identity and what impact did the vetting or not vetting have on the George Zimmerman case.

Click here to download or open a word document of the anonymous email .  How much weight would you give the details outlined in it? What would we have revealed if we all could have vetted this as we did other information that came to us in the case?


323 thoughts on “Email Author II

  1. Going back and reading some of my comments, I am a little embarrassed at how I got caught in the group dynamics at that time. Some comments that I made could have been miscontrued to appear derogatory when I meant them more as informative. I also saw the evolution of GB from one supportive of the legal team to being outright hostile. I still am not convinced that GBishop, GBishop1 and gbishop1 are all the same as their posts have a different tone to them, but it is just a feeling.

      • Danny, why would one sign on be lit up – as in those with a blog, and another not? Somewhere on this thread are 2 examples I found, on same thread as one another. They are of Ken/Scott. TIA

        • Depends what email they linked to WP. Seems the non highlited one they signed in just using a user name and email. I can sign in here using your name if I want. But Nettie will see the emails are not the same.

          If it is highlighted then an email account is linked to WP and that is how they signed in.

          A user can sign in either way. But if the blog mod. sees a different email then it may be suspicious.

          • If someone knows your email and user name and a blog mod. does not have the blog set to force a WP sign in other commenters will not know if it is really that person. The mod. will though. When a username isbighlighted then that means they signed in with an account linked to WP. WP use to not force users to sign up with gravatar, so some users that have been around for a long time do not have gravatar accounts.

            Also, WP will not allow someone to reuse the same email to create a new WP account. For instance I can not create a new WP with danny0warrior.gmail.com. WP will give me the username associated with that email.

        • TEST…….Lets see if I can do this….
          I am just filling in the details by hitting “reply”
          I did not fill in the website section. I had to change my email though or I would have been automatically linked to my WP through the email. All I changed was my email and my user name just a little.


        • Mimi. I tested something but because I changed my email it is in moderation.

          But it did not work. My username is still highlighted. I am unsure how not to have it highlighted. Maybe that is on a blog owners end. Let me do some research.

        • I found the answer.
          Only administrators have the priviledge to rename a user after they post. Usually this requires a code to be added to the comment.

              • Would the treehouse have the upgraded model? Could they change user names?

                I heard back from Robert Jr., the RZ posts on July 6th and July 13th are not his. He seriously doubts they are his father’s but I’m still waiting to hear from Robert Sr.

                This brings up another point and I noticed Coreshift suggesting to MOM that he verify his twitter account. People can create a user name and confuse others into thinking they are the same.

                If another finds themselves in the situation the Zimmermans did and did want to be online for purposes of clearing up false info. they would need to be recognized by the owner of the site (be it twitter, or a blog) with a recognized avatar so people know it is legitimate. Otherwise, it’s very easy to imitate and misrepresent.

                What security does WP offer so that others can’t easily imitate someone. For instance could I create a DannyWarrior name and profile picture using my email address? the admin. of the site could see it is a different address so hopefully if you’ve got honest ones, they will alert the readers it’s a fake but could such an imitation be done? If the family is trying to purposely use different emails to they can’t be located when safety is a factor, then they make it harder for even an admin. to know who is legitimate. we saw that play out on the treehouse where Sundance didn’t know if he was really talking to Robert Sr. at the time.

                • CTH has an upgraded account. So yes they have those capabilites. If they use them, only they know. There is evidnce they do.

                  As far as saftey features in us knowing who is legit? WP offers us to force the user to only comment IF they have a WP account. This way emails would be confirmed. They obviously can not confirm for us if it is indeed who they say they are though. Not even CTH can do that. You have to take a poster @ their word.

                  If you sign up for a WP account with a different email addy, yes you can create another DannyWarrior. But you would have to modify it. Like DannyWarrior2 or do something like I did above. You can also post whatever avatar youd like, including mine.

            • And remember when I talked to you about IPs and how it is possible to get more info. if a program is placed? If an admin. has those plugins they have the capabilities to better track IPs by placing in a html code into their blog. I personally am not interested in it, I know you are not but the fact some are is a lil creepy. The vistor came because of all the links we placed here.

              What we should do from now on. It not copy paste full links. It will make it harder for them to see who is referring. Let em work a lil 😉

              • I learned that trick when I was told about email safety. I was told to never click on a link that came in the email. Copy the link and paste it into a new browser. Then all the data about where the link was clicked from is lost.

                I do the same with links on the blogs. I copy them to a new window so the site I’m going to in the link doesn’t get feedback about where my “click” came from.

    • Amen Bori. I also feel very embarased at getting caught up in the group think at the time also. But hey, at least we learned and moved on. Not everyone did. I give us credit for that much.

        • You and some others here are a lot more knowledgeable about this entire case than I am. I have had more than my share of “sick days,” during which I missed a helluva lot of stuff. On a few occasions, I was taking some serious meds which may have been apparent in some of my comments. I apologize for that. I should have remained silent.

          Many times, I have nothing of substance to add to the conversation because I do not have the background ya’ll have on the subject I hand. In essence, I am only then learning what ya’ll already know.

          Such is the the case now so I have had to go back and review threads that I never read. So it’s very time consuming and frustrating. I do NOT like being the lowest on the totem pole. I am playing catch up. Am I making sense?

            • I remember your absence during that time. Are you now rested and healed?

              My medical issues are ongoing because after several years of trying almost everything, nobody has a solution except to prescribe pain meds and other types as well. I have not given up and keep doing research to try to find out the root problems. On some days, I should not be driving or blogging.

              • Well, ** slapping hand** don’t be driving!! Blogging not gonna hurt you or anyone else, physically anyway.

                I guess good as I am going to get lol. My ACL/PCL both torn. Someday will have to have joint replacement. But just tight, not really pain. Blessed on that for sure. I don’t like pain meds. Don’t like the way they make me feel. We aren’t really in control of much lol but I sure don’t feel it when take even small doses. I use Aleve. Works good for now. Hope you get answers you need and soon.

    • Oh I remb why I posted this now. WHY is the same signon name used and one is highlighted and one now. Same avatar too. On same thread. Does this mean using multi email? Confused, not that matter I was just curious

    • The timing of this; you posted tonight that Feb. 22nd was the first time CTH was mentioned in court.

      As dirty as the prosecution appeared to be, is it totally insane to consider that they read the Feb. 19th post and sent the Feb. 20th email to Sundance to discredit their opponent in court?

      • ROFLMBO… IF you read it *as BDLR writing it, visual him snickering with Guy over his shoulder, that too freaking funny. ESPECIALLY sense SD got so flipped out over it. BUT, in seriousness Naw, I don’t think so. I would be more inclined to think SD himself first.

        Crazy but the timing of a lot of things in that time frame, sure does make one go hmmm. Also, wonder why SD didn’t comment to Mr. Z when he commented. First time? IF he commented prior, sure didn’t seem like anyone of us know. Odd too that he wasn’t “welcomed” by TH admins…

        • That thought had occurred to me, not so much BDLR but someone else in the staff by that point they had deposed enough people to know some of the details on the family, and whether some people want to admit it or not even with Nelson’s help MOM was clocking the prosecution in every way.

  2. Did Obama really say this before he was president?

    ‘The fact that we are here today to debate raising America’s debt limit is a sign of leadership failure. It is a sign that the US Government can not pay its own bills. It is a sign that we now depend on ongoing financial assistance from foreign countries to finance our Government’s reckless fiscal policies. Increasing America’s debt weakens us domestically and internationally. Leadership means that “the buck stops here.” Instead, Washington is shifting the burden of bad choices today onto the backs of our children and grandchildren. America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership. Americans deserve better.’
    Read more at http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/debtlimit.asp#mcaO0zsvT7RPboqj.99

  3. Natalie Jackson
    1 October
    VOTE ALL OF THEIR BEHINDS OUT OF OFFICE….This needs to be a lesson for ALL POLITICIANS (but especially Republicans…NO both sides are not to blame in this instance)…you work for us…the AMERICAN PEOPLE…not yourselves, not special interest groups, and damn sure not the TEA PARTY nuts.

    • I got the message she’s proud of the Drudge report (I don’t even know what that is) noticing the treehouse and she’s ticked at the complaints here. They appear to be focussed on other things than the truth at the moment. Or am I misreading that?

      I didn’t get any disinfecting sunlight from her but I’m hoping some of the 8 of them give us an explanation.

      • Hahaha. I have a good guess who it was. She is CTHs internet troll! She will complain on any website that gives negative fedback about CTH. I mean…who does that? I could see if it was infowars or something…..oh wait…..But, even Alex Jones does go around bitching @ his critics.

        So I suppose other bloggers are not aloud to have an opinion or comment about their blog?
        Intimidation. Thatbis all it is. One would think they would support SUNLIGHT!

        Here is a hint visitor…..when you and the other mods refuse to listen to feedback about your blog then do not complain when they take it elsewhere. What nerve! Publicly you state you do not care but privately you complain? WTH? It must be uncomfortable to not be able to control everyones opinions here. Maybe what you should do is listen to opinions and choose to 1. Change your blog 2. Do not change your blog. But do not write another blog owner a bitch about what you do not like. Counter it. That is what I do! It is called FREEDOM OF SPEECH. YA know that very 1st Amendment of the US Constituation?
        Oh and of course you are proud of the Drudge. You should be, you all ride on the coat tails of others….I would expect you to at least be proud of those who plug your sorry butts.

      • Nettles, the Drudge Report is the opposite of the HP.


        I am sure you saw how biased the HP was, as if they were in cahoots with Crump. Now they are supporting all of this BS Honor Trayvon forever. He is a martyr, doncha know. I along with a couple other Treepers did our best to post on behalf of George but I gave up after constantly having most posts deleted.

        Here is the current Martin page. Yes, he has his own page. Notice the comments in any of the articles. What was your username? I do not recall seeing you there.


        • I got hammered on the Huffington Post as well. The worst experience was when I tried to defend Shellie and her right to have a trial before convicting her in the court of public opinion.

          In light of her plea and the supporting evidence, it does appear I got that one wrong. Shellie knew she wasn’t being totally honest.

      • I was thinking of someone else. But WOW! I think not all mods. have admin. privledges there so what they do is troll the net looking for CTH linking. Must have missed a few of the foul ones that link….. Oh well.
        One can have limited privledges on a WP account if it is set up. I wonder if the admin(s) even know they email people on behalf of CTH?

        • I asked Sundance who had access to emails at the treehouse in this exchange and here is his answer:

          Nettles18: “I’m surprised the treehouse got so many confidential emails when you have some many administrators. What are there, six people will access to the email account?

          *Answer from Me => No, there are more than six, there are eight site admins. Stella, Sharon, WeeWeed, Tilda, Adrem, Menagerie and patriot Dreamer. They all have access to the email and all exceptional in their integrity therein. They are remarkable in their character and retention of confidence – yes, they have also communicated with the direct Zimmerman family, and the fact you would not know that speaks to how good they are at confidence retention.”

          https://annettekblog.wordpress.com/2013/08/21/august-21-2013/comment-page-1/#comment-14833 (Posted Aug. 22nd at 4:52pm)

      • I just realized that I received not one comment here today. What a mess this Yahoo change has created.
        At any rate, I recently saw her comment on another blog.. maybe Dman’s?… that she does this.

      • Well the time SD copied my comment from here to there and commented, IIRC I was ganged up on by a couple mods. And told what I could do with my HUGS lol

  4. BAHAHAHHA Sundance Cracker cant stay away from George Z, even if his Admins want him too! Oh and he AGAIN using someone elses work.
    Woo Hoo Great Story, You go girlie!!!

    But on even More gratifying note… From SD latest thread

    Filing Information

    Document Number N12000003416

    FEI/EIN Number NONE

    Date Filed 03/30/2012

    State FL

    Status INACTIVE


    Event Date Filed 09/27/2013

    *Admin Dissolution For Annual Report – Means the foundation was administratively dissolved by the Florida Secretary of State Corporations Division for not paying fees and/or filing an annual report.


      The Miami Foundation administers all funds going directly to the Trayvon Martin Foundation.

      We thank you in advance for your donations. Please note that all funds donated to the Trayvon Martin Foundation are used solely in furtherance of the Foundation’s management and mission goals. No funds donated will be used to support litigation involving civil or criminal legal actions related to the trial.

      If you would like to mail in your donation, please make all checks/money orders payable to:

      The Miami Foundation

      (DO NOT make donations payable to “The Trayvon Martin Foundation”)

      Please mail check/money order to:

      The Trayvon Martin Foundation c/o The Miami Foundation
      200 S Biscayne Boulevard Ste 505
      Miami, FL 33131

      • It appears they may have intentionally dissolved the Foundation with a voluntary dissolution. Administrative dissolution does not mean the corporation has ceased its existence. Administrative dissolution does not terminate the authority of the corporation’s registered agent in this case which still is The Miami Foundation.
        It also appears the money may be going to the Miami Foundation. Perhaps why SFs speech included “loving Miami”. I just did not want anyone to get too excited like its proof of fraud like SD is making it appear.

        But who knows? Not enough info.

        • I recall Mr. Crump distancing himself from the foundation. That his legal firm was in no way associated with it however you could find public statements were he appealed for people to donate to the foundation.

          Then you have the statement that in no way will the monies be used for litigation in the case.

          So if all that is correct, does this mean that Crump, Jackson and others cannot bill the foundation for the time they spent on this case? How and when does this case pay off for Crump then?

          • Well, he has one settlemen from the HOA. I heard he wanted to sue the state, and he stated suing GZ but that was before aquittal.

            • I thought I read the settlement was the Foundation vs. the HOA, so maybe he gets fees for the settlement but I wonder if at some point we don’t hear a fight betweent the Martins and their lawyers and the Zimmermans and their lawyers and then of course there are the witnesses and their lawyers and some of the lawyers got lawyers.

              In the end, I hope everyone got what they needed. LOL

              • What I know of it was the Estate of TM vs. HOA. If Crump charged then I am sure he got some money from the settlement.

              • I am unsure if the Foundation would even have standing to bring forth a settlement . It brought out a biger name for himself as well. He is working another big case. All this guy needs to do now is keep suing /settling with cities, private insurance co., and the state.

                • Crump only takes cases where he knows he can shake down those with the big bucks like cities, police departments, states etc. He was taught by Bondi and Charlie Crist that all you have to do is call out the BGI and you are in the money. He started that with the Martin Lee Andersen case.

          • Oh and I am sure he is awaiting a Federal investigation that gives him rights to sue for a hate crime…..lol Remember this is only about what Crump believes. If he believed he would make money that was his motive to push this all the way to Holder. Reality though…. Nope.

            • I’m drafting an email to Mr. Crump. I want to reach out to him and see if he can’t enlighten us here as to why a seemingly educated man, took so much misinformation to the media. Does he feel any responsibility for the threats that the Zimmerman family live under today? Or the decline in race relations.

              If he has a case in the future are there any lessons he learned from this case that he could pass on to others.

              I’m getting largely ignored in asking questions of team defense, Zimmerman family, Treehouse Owners, and some reporters. I’ll keep asking, eventually the principles will tell their truth as they know it. I hope.

        • The guest post is up;

          Big Jim missed some research. That a corp. is a non profit does not mean they are automatically made tax exempt. So he is going to waste his time because the TM Foundation is a nonprofit which has yet or maybe will not file for tax exempt status. In fact it appears the Miami Foundation is their Fiscal conduit.

          What is a Fiscal Conduit?
          A fiscal conduit is an organization that is already incorporated and tax-exempt that administers funds and performs other administrative tasks for your group. Also called a “lead agency,” they can be invaluable in helping out with the organization of your group, reimbursing contractors, and sharing space.

          Here are some Q & As

          Are nonprofit and tax-exempt statuses the same?

          No, but they are closely related. Nearly all organizations that are nonprofit wish to be tax-exempt as well, so the terms are often confused. Many charitable organizations, for example, are nonprofit organizations and are recognized by the federal government as being tax-exempt. But becoming nonprofit and becoming tax-exempt are different processes, done at different times (usually), and by different government agencies.

          A first important distinction to make is that granting nonprofit status is done by the state, while applying for tax-exempt designation (such as 501(c)(3), the charitable tax-exemption) is granted by the federal government in the form of the IRS.
          To apply for federal tax-exemption, you need to have been granted nonprofit status first. Further, not all nonprofits are eligible to be tax-exempt.

          Nonprofit status:

          A nonprofit organization in its simplest variation, is any organization for which those who control or support it do not earn a profit. This doesn’t mean that a nonprofit can’t make a profit–quite the contrary is true. A nonprofit organization can produce goods and services, and it can earn a profit while doing so. It can even invest those profits (in the stock market, for example) in hopes of earning more money. However, all of the money made must go back into the organization–there is no “profit sharing” among members. Generally speaking, these organizations don’t have any owners. Hence, why we see a number of Directors of the Trayvon Martin Foundation.

          This is one reason that nonprofits are known more and more commonly as “not-for -profits.” They may make a profit to help them stay in business, but making money is not their reason for being.

          Individual states, and not the federal government, grant official nonprofit status. They may do so in slightly different ways, and give slightly different advantages for obtaining it. However, the federal government can recognize your nonprofit status. If you want to apply for tax-exemption, for example, you must be recognized as nonprofit by the federal government.

          There are three types of nonprofit organizations that are recognized for this purpose by the federal government:

          > A corporation,
          > An unincorporated organization, and
          > A trust

          The Trayvon Martin Foundation is a non-profit organization under the auspices of the Miami Foundation.

    • I read somewhere that there was a foreclosure on his and Alisha home. Not sure if this is it. Maybe their divorce.. no those aren’t criminal. Well have to look, but there are a lot of Tracy Martins that I heard people at TH talk about on the courthouse logs, that aren’t the same as TrayDad. thx

  5. The email author writes:

    “First, I called George again yesterday, and he briefly told me that O’Mara doesn’t want him talking to me.”

    “…he cuts me off when he has been using my writings, my research, my analysis, and the letters that have helped the case.”

    “…but he cuts me off right when I am getting through. He’s done it before.” (how did they get contact again?)

    ” I tried to call back George to give him the information, and he kept saying he was busy, he was busy. And then he changed his number, and his email.” (Then how did she/he talked to George yesterday?)

    George sends him/her out to source a new fund manger but when he/she tries to give him the information, George is too busy to receive it. hmmmmmmm

    • My question is how does this person resolve that the defense team is using their writings and research? It would have to be more then a mere comment here and there on a blog? Besides blog posts and comments are a compilation of all peoples input.

      Question? When first was CTH mentioned in court again? Anyone know off hand?

      • I’m told February 22nd.

        I recall a number of comments where people thought a motion that got filed was their idea or something said in court was because O’Mara read our comments on the internet. That wasn’t only at the treehouse, some participants on facebook thought their ideas were influencing what was occuring in the case. I recall BDLR asking West about it on the stand and West advised him, he didn’t get his legal opinions from strangers on the internet.

        • Hummmmm. Funny. The same day this email was written….

          And what did SD expect the email to influence you and the others he sent it to for ? To confirm HIS posts were the cause a motion was filed? And what other motion was he was talking about to Dman the next daybwhen he said to Dman that if it happened this email would confirm it?

          • The email was written on Feb. 20th. It was forwarded to 3 of us on Feb. 22nd after the hearing.

            Recall Sundance sent out a warning that if O’Mara didn’t perform on Feb. 22nd the way he thought he should, there would be disinfecting sunlight shown. Rumpole asked him if he could see the disinfectant stuff anyway and Sundance replied he is conflicted. I came to believe, Sundance is talking about the Feb. 20th email.

            • I meant fwd. But either way it mentions no motion what so ever. And obviously MOM did NOT use their writings and research. What motion happened between the 20th _22?

              • There was a hearing on Feb. 22nd about Crump’s deposition. Sundance thought O’Mara may be working against George and secretly helping Crump. He wanted to see how the Crump hearing to get deposed went before putting his brutual honesty out there.

            • I think I may be able to nail it down or eliminate a few UNs if I research the right info. Maybe we should research motions filed from Jan.~Feb. Which ones were filed?

              • Recall on Trayvon’s birthday, Feb. 5th, Crump walked into court and got himself out of the deposition he was scheduled to sit for that very afternoon.

                The judge allowed the suspension and said if the affidavit Crump filed didn’t meet the needs of the defense they could motion to have Crump deposed.

                The defense did file the motion (which I’m told this burden should never have been placed on them, but that’s the way it goes in Nelson’s courtroom) and the hearing was held on Feb. 22nd.

                In the early morning hours of Feb. 22nd, we are discussing how important this hearing is to uncovering the truth on what happened in this case.

                Sundance says if it doesn’t go well, he’s going to go places that some may not want to go. He said brutal honesty can be brutual. Rumpole posted and said, why should the outcome of the hearing matter? Give us what you know anyway. Later that night, I got sent the email.

                • The fact he felt this email then or now helps him is confusing. It proves nothing! Not that MOM was working against GZ, or with Crump. Not that he is NOT RM, not that CTH won the Zimmerman case!

                  • Clearly, he still thinks it helps him. He told everyone here that I won’t post the email because it is detrimental to O’Mara and the case.

                    It absolutely is not. As one George Zimmerman family member said, this was “100% not written by anyone in our family and it looks like the work of a crazy person.”

                    • With how many marriages he has had…..you have to succeed somewhere. Anon on the net being an audience member. People like this need help.They destroy lives.

                  • Why did he start talking about it in front of everyone in August? I know you don’t know but I’d like an answer to that Sundance.

                    Why did he bring up Ken’s name regarding this email?

                    • Inquiring minds would like to know….it is pretty drabby here with the lack of SUNLIGHT SUNDANCE! Enlighten us.

                    • I never in a million yrs. thought that supporters would be just as crazy as leatherheads! Just a few of supporters that is if you want to call them that!

                    • I can’t fathom how some got turned around thinking trashing GZ’s lawyer was saving him. Most especially in the weeks and days leading into the trial.

                      It’s like sabotaging your own country, in an effort to show the wrong guy got elected because you don’t like who got elected as the President. How dumb can some be?

      • I recall us brainstorming here about possible motions in limine that the defense could file in retailiation to the motions in limine the state filed.

        Some of state supporters thought the defense’s actual motion in limine was this blog’s idea. I highly doubt that but if the defense did read here, I’d like to think the group discussion helped them draft some they might not have considered.

        I recall hearing Mr. O’Mara say he’d be happy to turn off the internet and let the principles deal with the case. I wonder, overall, did Mr. O’Mara find the internet a total pain. Was it useful to him in getting George acquitted? If he had his choice in the matter, would he have turned all our voices off?

  6. I just came across the email I sent to George with my first donation, dated April 20th. Mr. O’Mara was impressive that day and I sent in a donation that night.

    Hi Mr. Zimmerman,

    I’m so sorry that you have found yourself in this tragic situation.

    We get upset when people stand by and do nothing but when people try to help and do the right thing it’s not always appreciated or turns out well. While no where near your situation, I often ask myself why I help others and draw all the negatives I do but I can’t help myself, I’d have to try to help if I can.

    I thank you for helping others and trying to do the right thing. I’m so sorry that that night went so wrong and Mr. Martin lost his life. I hope my donation helps you with your financial worries.

    Good Luck!

    – Annette Kelly

  7. I am just going to await this guest post @ CTH about the TM Foundation. And Nettles Pay Pal post. Take your time Nettles! Do not rush this one!

    • I’m relistening to the April 20th, June 1st and June 29th hearings. I’m re-reading Mr. Zimmerman’s book and I’m looking over the motions between April 11th and July 6th.

      I hope to post facts in the thread and leave my opinions in the comment section with everyone else.

      I’m also going to put together a video with the clips of what I want to draw people’s attention to and send an email to those who may shine light on the gaps. Their response or lack of response could be enlightening.

      It may take a bit of time but since we’ve talked in a round about way on this topic for so long, I agree with you Danny, take my time and let’s discuss this and put it to bed for good.

  8. In this jailhouse call with his sister on April 19th, GZ explains to her his call to Pastor Jones. Not to come to Sanford and rally but if he did come to come and pray with him at the jail. The pastor asks are you still going to be in there. GZ tells him, yes my lawyer said even if I get bond on Friday, I likely won’t get out until next week and that’s ok…he’s sister stops him and says really, you have to stay in until next week. That sucks. I’ll come down there with a boat-load of cash and get you out of there. George sounds fine with staying in for more days and giving the media and public time to calm down and not go after printing his family’s addresses.

    That is contrary to what the email author wrote in the Feb. 20th email saying George told O’Mara he couldn’t stay in one more day.

    His explanation to his sister about having to stay in starts around the 5:45 mark of this call.

    I also found the call where he told Shellie to relax, pray and tell the truth. I’ll include the audio of it in the pay pal discussion thread.

    • Pastor Jones, not Father Jones? I thought George said he was Catholic. That is one of the things that peaked my interest in the case. A detective said that when he learned Trayvon was dead he said he was Catholic and that he considers killing for any reason to be a grave sin.

      • Pastor Terry Jones wanted to come Sanford and rally. He is controversial and George was trying to dissuade him from stirring up emotions even more. He’s not George’s Pastor.

        Yes George is Catholic. I laughed in one call last night again with his sister Gracie. He relates a guard seeing he only has the bible to read and said why didn’t anyone give you something inspriational to read. George is astounded by that. He finds the bible very inspirational.

        I was also reminded how kind the family is. Natalie Jackson’s name was brought up by Gracie. She tells him of something inflammatory Natalie said on the news this night. George says, he’ll pray for her. They talk about her being Sherman Ware’s lawyer and Jackson also represented someone else they know. It struck me because the prosecutor didn’t redact Sherman Ware’s name but did redact the name of the other person Jackson represented that George and his sister know.

        Gracie said she was looking at images of his on the internet and came across this picture of Jackson with her client (that they know and the state redacted). Gracies is astounded how small the world is.

        You bring up another point that the anonymous emailer doesn’t know what they are talking about. In the first email to the treehouse they write “Curious and coincidental because I found out yesterday that O’Mara has forbidden George to associate with me. Isolating him from friends and family like he’s a child. He goes along to meetings with George’s pastor also. We are deep in the jungles of Guyana for sure.” George would seek counsel from a Father of the Catholic Church not a pastor. This person is reading the headlines.

  9. In this call, GZ tells his sister he is writing thanks to his supporters and apologizing at the beginning of each letter for his poor hand-writing. She agrees, his writing isn’t good and asks him to print. Then she wants to know more about the letters, does he have to leave them open for the guards to read. At 5:01 of this call, GZ tells her yes, unless it is to his attorney, the letters have to be reviewed. Which supports that it is illegal to listen in on or tape a conversation between a client and his lawyer.

    If the prosecutor holds any evidence of a conversation between Mark O’Mara and George Zimmerman, that prosecutor would be in violation of the law. Such evidence wouldn’t be blackmail material….such evidence would land those who recorded it or listened in, in jail. So we can all rest assured, only GZ and Mark O’Mara know what their conversations were.

    • “If the prosecutor holds any evidence of a conversation between Mark O’Mara and George Zimmerman, that prosecutor would be in violation of the law. ”
      Which is true & even GZ is aware of it. I am sure we all can throughly discuss all the cases that have resulted in that on the upcoming paypal thread.
      That fact the writer says it is video kinda gives away their BS. What is there purpose to claim they have knowledge of video to SD anyways? If the prosecutors have this video and MOM would know(he would have to know if this person knows of a video), one would think IF the prosecutors intended to use it against him he would file the proper motions because it is a violation of law.

      From all our research thus far it appears the author is a fake. Your above revelations coupled with your past few days of explaining how this person could have had contact after they were cut off before is telling it is a fake!

      There is much evidence…… and quote me on this ….The Author is Sundance himself. He fwd. it in hopes the upcoming motions would seal & settle his MOM conspiracy & create even more. He was heavily pushing for GZ to get rid of MOM at that time. Heavily! So, prior to the motion he fwd it to attempt to get Dman and Nettles on board (the most outspoken and trusted of commenters) so when he made these claims and revealved another lack luster source these two he fwd. to would support the Bash MOM party due to the email “source”.

      Thing is Nettie did not fall for it. He could not push the “source and conspiracy” because he knew Nettie would deconstruct the email especially after banning her. So he never mentioned it. And you know SD would not have released the whole thing. He even came here, claimed Nettie was misrepresenting what was written, and if it was posted we would see what she was doing. He refused to post it here and has not returned! Again, believing Nettie would not divulge the email. Then a boat load of CTH supporters show up here claiming this hurts GZ how an email SD told people about herevwas wrong to divulge.

      Also, there were two conversations ongoing on this blog atm. The paypal and my belief that it was Ken/Scott who advised GZ to move the money. Not MOM, because MOM had no clue about the volume.
      The other conversation was about SD being also RickMadigan. In order to defend against both these accusations SD felt SOMEHOW if he brought up this email to Nettie then he could prove both of us wrong.
      I for months have being bringing up sock accounts. It was one of the main reasons I opened my blog, to expose SD for the con artist he is. After the who “MOM advised on the settlemet” lie, I had enough!
      When he claimed he knew because he went and spoke with the “insurance underwriter” to get this info. (people believed him after this too) I had to expose him. I mean NOBODY, not even MOM waltzes up to an insurance underwriter and gets handed information on private settlement dealings. You would have to be brazen to even write a lie like that.

      SD has attempted to insert himself in this case soon after he found the connection of Julison and Team Scheme. Which btw was not hidden information. Any one of us could have connected it too if we cared!
      Did he have boots on the ground? Yeah he did. Talking to waiters, bellboys, &junior media clowns. He prolly did get opinionated info and he did share it in order to keep himself relevant. That is step one to gain trust.
      ANYONES opinion is plausible!
      But, it really was not a concern to me that he would or could affect the case besides trying to bankrupt it! Both the prosecutor and MOM saw he was irrelevant to the effects of their case which was their focus.
      It was not of consequence to either of them. SD focused on Crump, race and the media. He rarley focused on law and when he did he was wrong! Bernie had to love the fact SD supported his claims that this case was about race not the law! But in the end SD could not even help Bernie and Guy. Why? The law prevailed! Because the case was about wrongful prosecution and the right to self defense!

      But, many blogs and reputable sites were plugging him. Irresponsible on their behalf considering the trash he posted most times they should have paid closer attention. Or maybe they supported his topics.
      Look @ Cashill he wrote a book on CTH reasearch. I was going to buy it. I passed. If I want a time line of events outlined by CTH I can read it free and bypass supporting a website that cared nothing about GZ at all. Cares nothing about due process, cares nothing about individual rights, and uses lies to keep an audience coming back.

      I can say for certain SD is very good @ setting the stage to make it appear he actually had insider info. I suppose it was insider info. considering trash like this email was happening behind closed doors. This email is nothing more then an attempt to create ANOTHER lie!

      • Also, I have not read back over EVERY THREAD, nor care to but, your right, SD didn’t focus on LEGAL aspects. It was the likes of John Galt and Chip and MjW and tons of others who looked up and quoted and debated ACTUAL LEGAL CASES AND PRECIDENT! Learned a lot from those folks. What I see of SD is info found online and other peoples stories wrapped into stories at with a few thrown in opinions by the thread author. How many updates of the whole Scheme team connection were there? LOTS, with the SAME INFO, more or less bumped so to be the newest when searched.

        So what do 8 admins do if SD takes credit for “writing” all the articles? Must sure would be a lot of work if this “isn’t” his job. I think he trying to do what he accused Omara of doing on the CNN job…. Thinking of a paying gig….if not doing already.

      • Let me clarify one thing in this post. At the top of the email correspondence, where it is written, “this email is being sent to you b/c…” and then goes on to list the statement that the prosecutor is in possession of private talks between George and his lawyer, all of those remarks are Sundance’s remarks to Chip, Diwataman and myself.

        He is telling us that independant to what is contained in the emails he is forwarding, his research has found the same kind of stuff.

        As I said, I know very little of the law but I do know that there is no downside to a client being totally honest with their lawyer. His/her conversations with the lawyer cannot be used against them in a case. It’s illegal to do so.

        Where the anonymous writer comes in is after this part
        ——————————– Rec’d Correspondance Below ———————— Everything above that part, is Sundance writing to Diwataman, Chip and myself.

        There are 3 emails shared, the original one where the person contacted Sundance at 7:36 am on Feb. 20th, he replies at 10pm and the last one, OMG thank you for responding last.

        I spent last night listening to the jail house calls and given all the conversations I’ve had online since their release I wish I had listened to them way back then. It’s clear to me that leading up to the bond hearing, GZ was mistrustful and trying to be cautious. He expresses some concern about not hearing from O’Mara and not getting much of a chance to talk with him. I totally get that given what occurred with his last set of lawyers and their press conference on April 10th. After the hearing was held on April 20th, I listened to Shellie and George and the family’s reactions to O’Mara’s performance. They were blown away, super impressed and called O’Mara masterful. George is of the opinion he wants to get his parents to come up with what they can and after all those resources are exhausted, what’s left he’ll try to come up with. He doesn’t want to use a bondsman because he is fearful of more people knowing his address.

        O’Mara recommends this is the wrong tactic. He trusts the bondspeople and assures the family due to safety only a very short list of people will know GZ’s whereabouts.

        This tells me, GZ was never planning to flee. If he was, why not pay 10% get out of jail and take off. You don’t use most of your money to pay a full bail so you can get around another knowing your address. Why would you care, you’re taken off, right?

        After the hearing, everyone including George is saying whatever O’Mara says, we’ll do. I trust O’Mara. We should listen to O’Mara and by all accounts they did.

        There is also evidence in the calls that the relationship with GZ parents and Robert was strained prior to the bond hearing. They were not being kept in the loop of what was going on.

        I hope over time, the support that GZ’s parents gave plus Robert putting himself out there and all the hate he got exposed to, deposited some emotional currency in GZ’s bank account and brought the family closer today.

        • Right Nettles. Listening to the tapes all of them is how I formed my opinion of everything I have written to dispute SDs false claims. It is also how I resolved who was advising GZ on the money. This was research I did back before the 2nd bond.

          • I chose not to listen to the jail house calls initially. I found it just too invasive to listen in on Shellie and George’s conversation and it felt “icky” so I posted I would not listen.

            Over time, the arguement online about the passport and what was said and what was reported caused me to break down and listen to the calls the BDLR pointed to as code. In listening to the passport one, I’m of the belief Shellie is talking about her passport not George’s 2nd passport. I didn’t listen to any of the other calls until last night.

            There is evidence there that would have shutdown the conspiracy that O’Mara was part of the baked pie to railroad George. I have formed the impression after listening that it was as O’Mara stated. They weren’t totally honest. Not because they planned to run but because they were learning to trust no one. They cooperated with LE and got charged with 2nd degree murder. They got lawyers who held press conference saying they don’t know if GZ is stable or where he is. Which would have put a bounty on his head to find him. He got arrested the next day so thankfully the lawyers’ careless remarks didn’t cause the mob to go looking for him.

            I also found the answer to something I had wondered about given GZ and SZ splitting up after the verdict. I wondered if GZ was mad at Shellie for deciding to be less than honest on April 20th, It appears it wasn’t planned, she didn’t know she was going to be questioned about finances, so did her split decision to be evasive please George or was he freaked that she was less than honest?

            In the calls later in the afternoon of April 20th, he praised Shellie for the job she did in her testimony. So her answers were what her husband wanted her to say and he conveyed his gratefulness and love to her a few hours later over the phone.

            • Many felt “iky” and did not listen. That I understand. But, I did check it out because I wanted to see why MOM would not have protected his client. When I heard the tapes they confirmed everything MOM was sayin.
              As for the lying between GZ &SZ I did see why they did it once put in context. I do believe the split may have resulted IN PART in the fact she took a plea.

              • You said: I do believe the split may have resulted IN PART in the fact she took a plea.

                I agree that is quite possible and still think she did wrong by taking a deal. The probable cause document did not have all of the elements required for perjury. Branca and Mike McDaniel wrote excellent articles about this.

                Hearing that she took a deal shocked me. IMO, she got terrible legal advice.

                • As for legal advice, the deal she cut takes care of her and allows her to move on, but it was damaging to GZ. The charges were not going to be dropped, I don’t think that SZ and GZ had the resources to fight a protracted fight with the DA and another trial if it came to that.

                  I got the feeling that SZ’s lawyer wanted it over as well, a long fight is not something he was looking forward to. After a year and a half she wanted it over this was the quickest way to end the legal issues, not necessarily the best one, though all things considered.

    • You didn’t subscribe to this thread prior to tonight. You’ve made 3 comments on it, all tonight. It is the latest thread but it’s topic is the email sent to the treehouse. Although you posted you wanted to see the email, you have made it known this topic isn’t your cup of tea. You may not want to subscribe to this one. What’s New is the latest open topic thread. the second last one posted on the home page.

  10. Someone (Mimi?) on a previous thread wondered why a blog owner would close comments to a thread. I know some people do so they don’t have to “babysit” old threads – after a certain amount of time they close the comments, otherwise later, even as much as a year later, troublemakers could come along and post problem comments – then the thread/blog could get linked to for comments that present the wrong image of the blog – the blog owner might not even notice.

    • Well, I suppose I will let SUNSHINE in on my comment about that 🙂 TRUTH HAS NO AGENDA… I been looking over diff threads was actually looking for a comment but, on this certain thread, it struck me as odd, well kinda the last comment by M Simon. Then admin comment, and thread closed…Especially after SD made his comment about sewing room gossip or something like that as when they close a thread. I will tell you the name of the thread but not a link. And I will give no other comment 🙂 Subliminal – But I doubt intentional….. Actually, Unintentionally Revealing April 27 2012.

      • OK, I’ll post the link, I’m already in the dog house.


        Simon, whether he knew or not, posted a quote from Sundance who also posted under the name Mark Bradman on the Wagist site.

        Comments on the thread got shut down right after that. End of discussion!

        • I went to that Wagist blog. I was ROFLMBO Aussie54 (I think our Aussie) was posting on there about getting banned from CTH lol Made me laugh! Was posting with SD even funnier! Hugs Aussie

        • You have been in the doghouse a long time my dear. Just wondering when we will have protests again in revealing public info. that SD has confirmed? He had issue with Grio posting it made you remove the link but hell IT IS Still ON THE INTERNET! If it was indeed true he faced any type of assulats with boots on the ground from them posting that public info from his online profile best believe it would have been removed and people would have been arrested. I think that all was a lie too. It was an excuse because his lies about info he was recieving did not pan out. He had to give an excuse why he was no longer going on foot.

          • Way back when I was still at the CTH someone posted a link to a site that contained personal info. about SD. I think it included something about SD being behind on his taxes to the tune of about $23,000. The site seemed to be only that one post. SD and the mods didn’t seem to care, and the post with the link, more as a heads up to SD, remained on the page for a long time. I’m sure it has since been removed. If SD was so concerned with his personal safety, and that of his family, I wonder why no one jumped right in to remove the link. Do you remember that?

            • I was reading and looking for something when I came across what the Grio had posted . I immediately emailed SD and provided link and said was not my business but it just had gotten posted. Just a heads up. I don’t regret sending that email. Whomever the admin was that emailed me back, said thank you and they were aware. Within about 15 min people were posting heads up to SD on the blog.

              • I noticed a tweet by Frances Robles on July 30th which led me to Big Boi’s twitter feed and it indicated an effort out reveal who Sundance was.

                I sent an email to the treehouse to give them as heads up. I rec’d a thank you and was told if I saw anything else to let them know.

                • I say stupid, because, for someone who supposedly wanted to be Anonymous and then goes about wanting people to edit comments, THEN to go and flat out admit. Just odd, maybe better word, after stating how much danger he himself as well as his family have had to endure.

                    • I think its probally because he loves to play in riddles. And I think its very much on purpose (duh) but I mean it gives him the wiggle room, the same wiggle room he trashes others about.

                      I still want to see what he was going reveal after Chump was known to have gotten deposed.

    • The blog owner should notice because every comment in the order they want comes in.

      I had the option to automatically shut-down the comments on a thread after so many days (I got to pick how many days) or leave it open.

      In researching why I would want to shut it down, one reason was spammers have a habit of spamming old threads so by shutting down comments after the participants have moved on would help reduce spam.

      • Way back when I had signed up for email notifications from a particular article at Mike McDaniels. Months later I was getting notification of new comments which were all spam. I tried to let Mike know that was happening but, the comments section is still open I believe. I think it was the DD Kaboom article.

        • Well, you’ve just solved that riddle for me. I wondered why spammers would hit old threads if no one sees their message but yes, anyone registered to follow that thread would get an email message of the spam.

          • My thing was, and never thought about it til SD made that smart ass remark about how/why they close threads. I knew or thought I knew that all threads were not closed. I saw many that weren’t.

            • The first time I could recall a thread ever being closed was at Diwataman’s blog. He shut down the “Crump gets paid thread”. That thread is the one where Rick Madigan came and stirred everyone up. Then the treehouse bashed Danny while banning his voice there. Diwataman didn’t like his blog being the vehicle to respond to the treehouse’s accusations.

              He told us all to start our own blogs and respond. The problem with that of course, is our new blogs wouldn’t have the target audience we wanted to read the response. So essentially both Sundance and Diwataman worked together on that one to shut down a number of voices.

              • Which is why I was pissed! I was willing to drop the discussion about SD. You can go back and see I tried because you all were concerned about Dman locking his blog again. He had just opened it for comments just prior to that. SD send all GZ discussions over there. But it was SD/ RM who decided to confront me and I was not suppose to respond! That is slimy. SD banned me. Dman was upset I responded there but allowed bashing of MOM supporters and allowed antagonizing of his usual posters. I said my peace and left. Most then followed.

                • I decided to take Diwataman’s advice when I visited his site to see yet another MOM bashing thread. I thought we needed a blog that didn’t shut down voices in support of O’Mara’s efforts. I worried about only reading criticisms might give the family the impression most thought that way. You can certainly make it look like that if you signal supportive comments won’t be tolerated.

                  I wanted to discuss how we could attack the prosecutors and the Scheme Team not our own side.

                  Thank goodness, GZ’s side prevailed. GZ was acquitted. Now as we wait for the legal response to get started (civil suits, sanction hearings), this is the time to reflect on all that occurrred, learn some lessons and hopefully become more powerful and smarter in attaining our goals in the future.

                  • When it comes down to it. I know my opinions matter none. The only thing that does matter is the Jury! It is an affirmative right that a defendant has for a trial by jury. If the public perception is that being a juror is to please one side or the other then defendents will have a hard time getting fair trials. So where one group of supporters bash an atty. who is affording a defendent that right they sure are not supporting confidence in our judicial system. If I am wrong, then this jury was wrong! MOM chose a great jury. The jury took their time. Follwed the law and that is all I hoped for. ,

                    • The jury issue was a concern for me. I heard Crump and Bernie a few times speaking about how TM would not have a fair trial. WTH? These men are supposed to be laywers! They passed the bar exam yet do not get that it is the defendant, the one accused of the crime who deserves the fair trial!

                    • I meant to comment on this earlier, but that narrative by the prosecutors, the scheme team and the media was always preposterous and disingenuous GZ was the only with his life on the line.

                      Even after the trial, it was not about how the evidence did not fit the crime but about how TM never got a fair trial. The evidence is still being forgotten and not discussed to GZ’s detriment.

  11. Got some things to do so gonna say see ya later alligators. My Brother from out of state is coming in for the weekend. So if I am scarce lol I am just having fun with family. But will be checking in. lol. Hugs and Happy Early Weekend!!1

  12. Excuse me for interrupting but I have one more thing that I’m curious about. I hope you don’t mind me asking it here. This is where everyone seems to be right now. What is the name of the blog that the Treehouse Conservatives branched off from?

  13. I’m going to post this so I don’t forget about it and check it out when I get time. On April 19th, GZ is talking with his sister about a story that got printed yesterday that he stayed at a friend’s home. By the sounds of it, that article is totally wrong and GZ and his sister, Gracie wonder where and why people make up stuff.

    I wondered if this wasn’t Frances Robles article stating GZ stayed with Mark Osterman after the shooting. Didn’t Mark actually testify to this at the trial? I’m not sure of the date of Robles article about Osterman or whether it is this article or another that falsing printed where GZ was after the shooting. If anyone does have some time and can find some answers, I’d appreicate you posting it here. Thanks.

    • I so wished you would have listened to these a long time ago. It puts a lot in perspective does it not? Wonder why I was so critical of SD now? Wonder why I KNOW some of the people he claims contacted him or posted to CTH were maybe not who they said they were or had an agenda to post if they had indeed posted? It helped me to watch certain people who were and still are posting!

      • Danny please don’t take offense, but sometimes is not the message but the way it is delived that turns some people off. This is especially true if you are unsure of the information yourself or who the messenger is.

        • I believe she understands what I mean. It was not to imply she disregarded anything. It was in fact to show I am not the great smarty pants some think I am. I suppose I failed again. It also was in context to Nettie stating the reasons why she feels it is important to now lay things to rest. Such as her thoughtswe could now be focusing on the civil aspect. That was what my comment was intended to convey.

          • I’m sorry Danny, I knew what was your intent and knew you were not a; being accusatory and b; not claiming anything else, I was just pointing out that somethings the way you get your point across can come off as abrasive to the point that the message is lost. Definitely not as bad as RM or Sharon who when she got started was scathing but you get the point.

            • Understand please bori, I type on a touch screen. I love to just get to the point! I HAVE TO COUNT BACK SPACES BECAUSE i can not even see when I type. And copy pastes suck!

              • Danny, I love your style as you say you get to the point and quick. Mimi is like that, and Jordan is in a way too, but does it with questions to clarify. We are good, don’t misunderstand.

                • Bori NEVER. You man were the first to make me look at my style. To suppport my the complexity of my thoughts. I understand your concern and I appreciate it. Thank you for letting me explain to everyone.

                    • Nettles reminds me of my Auntie T. TT as I call her is so relaxed. She is chill! Close nit family oriented But damn she can get nasty! Sometimes I am like “Aunt TT” OMG! That is Nettles to me.

                      Let me see um artart reminds me of my brother (no offense we are talking personality here) Comes out of the woodword like a scientists stuck in the lab doing experiements then tests our brains.

                      Oh gosh Mimi and Mini are like my pesky half sisters. I swear! Double trouble!

                      Jordan reminds me of my Pop. That is my Moms Dad. He tries to please everyone. Stays out of conflict.

                      Who did I miss?

                      Bori, you are my like my wife! Sorry! She totally supports me but is like WTH did I get myself into, really you said that outloud! And then she apologizes for me! Then I am like honey really? She is like yeah….over the top! I am like yeah a lil but…..

                      Hooson….is Dr. Phil!

                    • I don’t know if I should be offended or not! Kidding, Hooson as Dr. Phil, ha ha funny, you know when he first posted I thought he was one of the producers for the show.

                    • LOL!! Now that would be something, I can see the promo,

                      “Meet the bizarre and craze people who spends hours blogging on the internet. You get to meet some of them and we will ask questions to see what motivates them.”

                    • Yeah. So you will not find a crazed man whos home is unkept. I am mobile. I can multitask Dr. Phil! Kids not in jail, well educated and no…. I will not give up my ways of functioning because that is not your goal. Phil focuses on experiences he and his wife have had. Which include addiction through their personal experiences which just show others addiction and raising good kids IS possible. When it skipped a generation because one of their kids were addicted. They hide it! It also shows his wife with all possibilites choses only through him to be an advocate! Making people cry is easy!

                    • Every now and then….sure. But to relate to a few beverages and beating or leaving your kids to be a drunk is AA mind game. A shot here or there will give me drunkenedness. How do I avoid cancer?

                • LOL MIMI STRAIGHT TO POINT?!! Bori my Love, you’re too funny. Sometimes I go way around the county trying to get back to where I think I am going. I post too long and too much but don’t mean to. I am always afraid I am not explaining what I want to convey. Thank you though for your kindness 🙂

                  • I was super duper impressed with your conversation with Sundance on his last visit.

                    You were clear, concise and bang on target with your conversation with him. Marvelous Job!!

                    • Thank you. I was angry and felt bad afterward for doing it on your blog. He really hit a nerve when he spouted out about your absence. THAT well lets just say was just complete and utterly disrespectful. ((Blushing)) thank you again tho. I don’t think he has been back since has he? I wonder if he felt ashamed of some of the crap he said and couldn’t edit. I hope he is and was.

                    • The part about my absence was just a distraction and I think he may have hoped to anger me with it. No such luck.

                      You were great at counter arguing his points and you had the facts. I read it about 12 hours after it occurred and I kept a huge smile on my face and saying “Yes Mimi…You tell him girl!” You expressed yourself very well while not personally attacking him at all. It really was a great exchange. Would have loved to watch you talk with him after you had a chance to read the email he told you so much about but refused to show you.

                      I’m surprised he hasn’t been back since and can’t figure out why. I hope he does return to explain why he gave that email so much credit and why he thinks O’Mara and George could be taped or how he thinks O’Mara controlled the family and friends as he alleges.

        • Actually bori I was working on who the messenger is when I lost my links in order to reply to you. Most of my research I have to re~research because the device I use is not a laptop or PC. I am limited. Most of it is in my head. I just as everyone here paid attention to differing aspects of the case as it was ongoing. Most did not at the time suspect SD of being a untruthful blogger. Just as I had not paid attention to subjects that interested Nettles or you. Of course she could come back to me and say “You are a supporter, and you do remember the date of the motions?”

          I think I have been clear on the importance to expose SDs agenda. Do I know it all? Nope. I do not believe I ever portrayed myself as a know it all. I can only ask the community their thoughts, and of course I place myself in the position to be scrutinized. I am not attempting to expose in real life people but the sock accounts they use and have used to push an agenda. For some I understand it embarrasses them for following the crowd. I hold nothing against those who were duped. I hold it against those who duped.

          I think Nettles understands the importance as from day one my position has been to expose the dupers….ALL of them. I think I as well as Nettie have learned more then a few things for next time. Being there are some MANY MANY good advocates here with a head on their shoulders it truly would be a waste not to rummage through some things.

          I could care less if we know the author. But in discussing who it may be it has been revealing in more ways when one. Sundance has a voice. So do the others. They still are around and about. They can choose to speak. I have supported everything I have stated. Supported my opinions. My delievery? It is me. It is how I do it. That is something I will not change. Some are forgiving, some are not. You can only please 50% of people 50% of the time!

          • I agree, you can’t change who you are and I was not asking you to, I like it it’s you. Your point about the motivations of some of the bloggers is spot on, sometimes I got the impression some would have preferred for GZ to go to jail. This was SD’s baby if you notice the participation of the mods at the beginning and how few of them posted towards the end, they might have been involved but not participating, and even wanted to stop the thread altogether.

            • Personally, if I could have given GZ and his family a haven I would have. It was not my place however. So I did and am still trying to do what I can so he can move on. He should have ever been arrested! Never been the poster guy for SYG OR race relations. Fromday 1 that has been my pulpit!

  14. Here’s an email I sent to Ms. Robles of the Miami Herald (it’s long-winded but she and her judgements made me mad). This was in response to her article in the paper, http://www.miamiherald.com/2012/10/25/3067603/sanford-court-hearing-set-on-gag.html telling her readers the defense team was using internet people connected with a conservative blog that hosted racist commenters. This was her linking my facebook post about an email the defense team had sent to racists posting at the treehouse.

    I copied the defense team in the email. The Subject line read “I’m not a racist”

    “From: Annette Kelly
    Sent:October-26-12 5:35:39 PM
    To: frobles@miamiherald.com
    Cc: O’Mara Law

    Hi Ms. Robles,

    I wanted to give you more insight into at least one of the George Zimmerman supporters, me, to give you another perspective in what the “activists” as you called them in your article last night have convinced you I may have some racist bias. If not me, then perhaps others?

    I have been surprised by your reporting that appears to see Trayvon Martin as an innocent victim who was shot by a wannbe cop George Zimmerman. That is one perspective, but in light of the State’s discovery, where’s the voice on the other perspective; that a troubled teen was left alone in a City with nothing to do and found trouble and his parents launched an all-out campaign with the help of the media. Anyone who didn’t see their son as an innocent victim, must be racist. The shooter, the Sanford police, local prosecutors, the defense team and all GZ supporters.

    In your latest article, you tell the readers that I (thanks for keeping me unnamed), post on a conservative website. I do know that some of the “activists” view the Treehouse site as a racist site but I totally disagree. I have not seen it on the threads that I visit. The only threads on that site that are of interest to me are the George Zimmerman threads. I’m from Canada and have no interest in the political push and pull that goes on in the United States. In Canada, my views are very liberal.

    I also post on TalkLeft, Huffington post, Washington post, Orlando Sentinel and Miami Herald in relation to this case. What does that mean? Am I to be associated with all others that post on these sites as having the same views? In your article you just referenced one site where I post.

    Trent Sawyer, (StateoftheInternet) got very upset with me last Thursday when I mentioned his name on a facebook debate page. Trent, if you are not aware, is very upset with the Treehouse, not for racist comments but for posting his youtube videos of last Friday’s hearing. http://theconservativetreehouse.com/2012/10/19/the-groundwork-for-malicious-prosecution-george-zimmerman-case/ In the videos, Trent provides his commentary of what he thinks of George Zimmerman, Mr. O’Mara and the defense strategy. The treehouse commenters commented on his commentary. I did not comment on that particular thread at all. Trent has lied and told others that I posted about his sexuality and the Treehouse removed it. That’s flat out a lie. Sundancecracker probably had no idea who I was prior to the outed post. I’m sure he didn’t know that I posted there when he posted the story of the outed email. I’d say I have less than 20 posts since April 2012.

    I believe Trent used you in getting back at me and the Treehouse. On a debate page on facebook where both Prosecution supporters and GZ supporters come together to talk about the case, Trent’s commentary on those videos was brought up. I posted I thought his commentary was hilarious and thanked him for providing us a copy of hearing. That was sincere, I missed parts of it due to work. Unbeknownst to me, Trent didn’t want his name mentioned on the debate page. Someone told him I posted his name and within 5 minutes of my posting he came in with some vile, vile language. The moderator at the time, who was also a prosecution supporter, deleted Trent’s posts for breaking the rules of the page of no insulting each other and Trent went off on him. The debate page is moderated by both sides at different times.

    I think you are being used by these activists to get at GZ supporters. As you know, I was quite offended to hear you characterized us a Trayvon Martin Haters. I have been talking with GZ supporters online since mid-April and that simply has not been my experience. No one I’ve seen believes TM deserved to die that night. However, when you tell SOME prosecution supporters that IMO, the shooting was justified as GZ was in fear at the time he shot, they hear me saying Trayvon deserved to die.

    I have seen repeatedly, GZ supporters telling prosecution supporters we all wish Trayvon was still here. Every single one of us made stupid mistakes in our youth and but for dumb luck, we lived through it. Trayvon wasn’t as lucky.

    In retaliation to my posting Trent’s name on the facebook page (which I wasn’t aware of at the time was his desired wish), Trent has launched an all-out online assault on me. You can find many rants on facebook and twitter pages now. Whenever I post anything, someone named Andrea tweets my post out. A subtle message to me that I’m being watched. They’d be real happy if I was silenced. That’s unlikely. They don’t want me silenced because of racist posts (there aren’t any), it’s because of the questions I’m asking and the proof I’m posting.

    Coincidentally, I administer a website for a local food bank and soup kitchen here in Brampton, ON. On Saturday morning at 4:40 a.m. it was hacked. The page read “You’ve been hacked” when visitors went to the site. The Soup kitchen needed to spend $100 to get it back online. The security for knowing how they got in was not on the site, so I can’t prove anything. I learned of it on Monday.

    At first, I wondered if it was Trent or was I just being paranoid? Then comes the tweeting by Trent of the email I posted in a private facebook group on Monday. Was there a mole in the room? Or was my post picked up from my computer being invaded? The screen shot of the post is not formatted to how it appeared in the group. On Tuesday, the food bank I help out, received tweets not to take donated food from the racist, Annette Elaine Kelly.

    Now, from what I’ve seen of the Martin/Fulton family, they would cringe at the actions taken by these activists in the name of their son. Making life difficult for a food bank and soup kitchen? Just as George Zimmerman cringes at the activists on his side spewing hate and racist speech. Thankfully, on both sides, there aren’t many of these activists but they are rather “active”.

    I think with your article, you may have emboldened them even more in their attacks on supporters they don’t agree with. The prosecution supporters and the George Zimmerman supporters should not be the story. What actually happened that night and how charges came to be laid should be the story. It’s quite a stretch to take my post and link it with the Treehouse (who don’t know me from Adam) and link that to racists posts (that I have never seen or participated in).

    I’d appreciate it if the next time you hear someone being called a racist, you ask for proof. The activists have convinced you the Treehouse is full of racist supporters, I don’t see it.

    I’d encourage you to read the debate page on facebook and learn about both sides. You may be surprised to learn about the friendships that have been established across the lines. The “activists” don’t like that supporters can agree to disagree and they are working hard to silence the voices that don’t think the same way they do. Prosecution supporters got mad and reported the debate page we’d been using since August 22nd and got it put into facebook jail yesterday. Another one opened up to keep the conversation going. http://www.facebook.com/GzVsTmDebateCenter?ref=stream . It appears TM supporter are largely boycotting it.

    I don’t hide behind fake pages. I do understand why most do. The activists on both sides report and spam comments all the time. Their accounts get put into facebook jail for 10 to 30 days at a time. This is all done in an effort to silence the other side. I am accountable for my posts. Like the legal team, I am confident that my posts are defendable. I have a great many questions about the inconsistencies the family of Trayvon Martin have told from the beginning and I will keep pointing them out and asking questions until I understand what happened.

    Some of your readers may have the mistaken impression that a racist posted a private email on facebook and you may recall, you printed my full name in your news article and got a Minister to give you a quote that George Zimmerman donors are racists. http://www.miamiherald.com/2012/05/11/v-fullstory/2794656/trayvon-martins-mother-got-about.html

    As we learned, an exhaustive FBI investigation, found no racism in George Zimmerman’s background. Your reporting in reference to me and others like me hints at racists. I think in that respect, your reporting is inaccurate.

    I apologize to the legal team for my thoughtless mistake in exposing a private email that wasn’t even sent to me.

    – Annette Kelly

    • Nettles, out of curiosity did she respond? My first blog post was in response to an article she wrote back in May of last year. I too wrote her an e-mail but I seem to have erased it, and she never responded. I twitted her as well, but she ignored all but one of my tweets.

      • Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 15:44:16 -0400
        Subject: Re: I’m not a Racist
        From: frobles@miamiherald.com
        To: Annette Kelly

        Hi Annette,
        Sorry it has taken me a few days to get back to you. I was not in front of a computer for a few days and didn’t want to respond using my touch-screen phone.

        I understand how you are feeling in this incident. However, I don’t think I’m being “used” by Trent, because this has nothing to do with me and nothing to do with you. The only issue, as I see it, is that O’Mara got caught red-handed using members of the public as research assistants. The fact that you sometimes post on the CTH cast a negative light on the incident, because it’s a very controversial website. There is just no getting around that. I did not call you a racist, and I pay no attention to the name-calling on Twitter.

        I can imagine how you feel about being hacked: CTH posted a very long blog posting about how they had intercepted my text messages and Direct Messages on Twitter.

        I appreciate that you were put in a terrible situation last week. You at least have the courage to post under your own name and, as far as I your dealings with me, have never resorted to rude insults. I appreciate our dialogue. I can’t say the same of most of the CTH users, who are a bizarre bunch.

        I hope the flap died down.


          • That what was so shocking. She followed them all on twitter. She knew exactly what they were like. She started following me and my stalker afterward but she never made another comment about what she thought.

          • Ridiculous comment by Robles. Raised as a Catholic Democrat now an atheist independent plus a anti-crime and youth violence activist living in a black inner city neighborhood and not a gun owner I found Robles reporting as controversial as the CTH.

            • She is a product of the New York dogmatic left, GZ had many strikes against him a; he used a gun, b; he was not black c; in their eyes he did not mind his own business, d; TM was black and killed by a non-black in the South

              Any of these is enough for those that follow the dogma to find GZ guilty add them and it was irresistible. Not all bought into this, but the dogmatic one could not help themselves.

        • While Ms. Robles seems to think reaching out and asking for help was the wrong thing to do, I disagree. The defense team didn’t back away from asking. After the email was in the public being talked about, the defense took a megaphone and asked for help.


          “Although we originally intended for the message to be private, we feel the message is sound, and since it has been made public, we extend the invitation to anyone who has an interest to participate: send us a link to any statement the defense has made publicly about the case that you think is inappropriate.”

          I still think she was telling her readers GZ supporters were racist.

          • I was thinking about this for quite some time. If GZ was white do you personally think SD would have went to bat for GZ? Of course I have a theory. Do not want to entrap anyone. So think about it.

              • Last night, I came across a blog. A WordPress Blog. It was set up JUST LIKE CTH. Except it is a very racist type site. I think I was reading a comment MinPin had made asking if someone knew about the blog or owner because of the content. I do realize that there are prob a few diff templetes if you will, to choose from. I wonder if it was made to look like the CTH on purpose. I just read a few things there and felt like I needed a shower and brain cleaning. Horrible.

            • If George were “white” (as opposed to partially white, I guess), would SD have gone to bat for him?

              Or did you mean if Trayvon were white, would SD have gone to bat for George?

              • No we already know if TM were white SD would not have gone to bat for GZ…..
                We also know if GZ was black he would have not gone to bat for TM. We know if both were black SD would not care so…if GZ were white……

    • I just wanted to note… I do not have a facebook account. I had one @ the time of the GZ legal case. I got rid of it. Many news and blog sites link, I have no access to view those accounts even for research because they REQUIRE an account. I can not even comment because some sites only allow FB log ins. I avoid them because they are forcing a FB account. Even my own local news paper I write handwritten because they have no other option to comment.

      • When the defense legal page on facebook started up, I recall them thinking at least you have to post as yourself, no anonymous posting. I bet you they learned some stuff too!

        • I closed my FB after whats his name I asked you about the EMS guy kept somehow coming back! That was way before the site was closed.

  15. I can’t find where I asked this earlier. Someone said something about GZ asking for his pastor, Pastor Jones. I thought GZ was Catholic. Am I wrong? I believe he told a detective he was when he learned Trayvon was dead.

    • I just answered your first post on it. George is Catholic. Pastor Terry Jones wanted to do a rally in Sanford and while in jail, GZ reached out to him and asked him to reconsider that.

      He invited the Pastor if he did come to town to visit the jail and pray with him instead. I don’t know if Pastor Jones did that or not.

    • I have some confusion about that myself but I think Pastor Terry Jones was offering to come and protest Zimmerman’s arrest, he called Zimmerman and GZ said not to do that but pray, so I don’t think he was his pastor at all, the church is like 2+ hours away.

      Pastor Jones is a controversial figure, burning Korans among other things so GZ told him not to do it.

      • You note though, the anonymous email writer, says controlling O’Mara goes along to GZ’s visits with his pastor.

        As Pondering Observer points out, GZ wouldn’t have a Pastor.

        The writer, it appears, has been influenced by the headlines about Pastor Jones.

      • From my recollection Jones wanted a two tone visit. He was going to burn the Koran in advance of this issue. He contacted GZ to say he would support him. GZ kindly said it was best if he just prayed and if he did come for GZs purpose do not burn the Koran.

          • I listened to the call last night. George asked him not to hold a rally in Sanford but if he did want to come, to come to the jail and pray with him instead. The Pastor said he would. I heard George when on another call, he interrupts the call and asks the guard who came by to put Pastor Jones on the visitor’s list.

            I don’t know if Pastor Jones visited or not that weekend. It was the weekend of April 21/22. GZ had gotten bond on April 20th and left the jail house just after midnight on April 23rd.

              • Settling people’s emotions down appeared to be the immediate strategy of both O’Mara and George. Just like the domestic dispute, when one is in a heightened emotional state, we don’t always think or act rationally.

                GZ asked the Pastor to let Sanford heal, let America heal and please don’t rally to keep the pot stirred. If you want to help Pastor, pray for us all, Come pray with me. We need understanding.

  16. I think I understand now. Pastor Jones wasn’t George’s pastor, but a controversial pastor who got attention for burning Korans. George just didn’t want him to get him more negative attention, but told him he could go to the prison and pray with him. A Catholic can pray with any Christian. I think that email you were referring to called Pastor Jones, George’s pastor. That was smart of George.

    • That is another reason why the e-mail was suspect to me, as Pastor Jones was not GZ’s pastor but an attention seeking pastor who likes to insert himself into stories, much like Sharpton. IMO the writer read about the Pastor coming from his church 2 hours away to pray with GZ at the jail, which we don’t know if it happened, and incorporated it into the story.

    • Jones wanted to exploit George and the controversy, and would have wound up making George look like the head of the KKK.

      George finessed him out of it in a way to which Jones couldn’t publicly object.

  17. I stand corrected on when an apparent change in fund managers for the donation account occurred. I had said it happened around the time GZ’s parents started their website. In reviewing old emails, I see that something changed with the donation account around the end of the year. The site stopped taking the monthly donations and everyone had some trouble for a few days getting their donation through. For unknown reasons, I couldn’t pay through pay pal b/c the site wouldn’t take donations outside of the U.S. so I had to mail a check.

    In trying to get it resolved, I mailed a check on January 9, 2013 so it was around this time and not around the time the parents started a website that a change in fund manager occurred.

    The parents started their website on July 26th and for reasons unknown, the legal support team on facebook went quiet for over a day. We could not get verification from the legal team whether the parents’ website was legitimate. I don’t think they ever publicly acknowledge the parents’ site. All inquiries went unanswered as well as the inquiries to George’s site.

    It was announced to everyone by this posting at the treehouse. When you read the comments, you see the admin who posted the thread, vouched for the authencity of the site and said if something got posted at the treehouse it had been vetted first. Some sent messages to the parents’ contact email on the new website and got a return response from R.U. Loco and this began another round of questions about the legitimacy. Both the treehouse and the Justice for GZ facebook page said it was legitimate and Robert Jr. confirmed it was his parents’ site,

    When Mr. Robert Zimmerman emails, the address today still reads R.U. Loco – I never did understand this. But it is what it is.

    • That’s so wonderful of you. I sent small amounts and am so grateful to the rest of the people who sent donations.

      • I’m grateful too to all those who were able to contribute money to the cause. There is no way those in power should have done to George what they did. I was heartened some that thousands of strangers saw this for what it was and dug into their pockets to stop it.

        • So am I. Maybe we’re all grateful for each other. When you see a wrong that is so very wrong, you first feel helpless to correct it, but when we realize there’s many others willing to take a stand and give money, we can see God active in His world pulling heart strings.

    • I never donated to that fund because it never was confirmed nor was info vetted in the proper forum. For all I know R.U. Loco is someome getting a cut of the fund. Around the same time SR. send photos and Xmas wishes to CTH.

      It is apparent and Nettles that is why I only wished you listened sooner to the tapes, is because Jr. and Sr. were not as close to GZ as they have maintained. Even SZ did not want them to know details. GZ relied on SZ parents the whole marraige. In fact if you have yet heard on the tapes GZ calls Ken “the brother he never had.” Obviously things changed. It seems he was close to his sisters and that is it. Either ever spoke out.

      • I didn’t donate to the fund either. I wasn’t totally comfortable whether it was legitimate or not. Without GZ’s representatives coming out and endorsing it, I felt better giving to a known GZ fund, the defense fund. That is after all why I was involved, to hopefully level the playing field in mounting a defense for George.

        While I agree, the phone calls do show there was a strain between George and his parents and older brother at the time of his arrest, I have always thought they were cut out from the details of GZ’s defense.

        People would email me screen shots of Robert Jr.’s message and I kept telling those who thought they were getting inside information, for a whole host of reasons, GZ’s family may not be privy to the defense and its strategy.

        Those reasons were because they were witnesses in the case, they were speaking out publicly and the defense posted a thread separating themselves from the pubic remarks. Reminding us that the family was speaking for the family, not the defense of GZ.

        I did hear the call with Ken. GZ called Robert “useless” and was grateful to have Ken as an “older brother”.

        I trust over the course of this trial, these two brothers (Robert and George) became closer. I sure hope they did.

      • I think that Nettles and I were talking about the fund on O’Mara’s website. I felt confident about that. I did not even hear of the Treehouse until after the trial. I trusted O’Mara. I was surprised to read negative things about him in “If I Had a Son.” After the trial was over and Robert senior’s book came out, I contributed to his fund. I found it on Robert Jr’s twitter profile so I figure it should be legitimate. I have to admit that I was taken aback when I saw their email address is UR Loco Loco. I felt like I’d been laughed at and I sent an email to the Treehouse asking if they knew anything about that. I don’t know why they have that email, but I do trust it’s legit. If someone was impersonating Robert Junior on Twitter, he surely would bring that to public attention.

        • There IS a fake IIRC the spelling of Zimmerman has 2 N’s or maybe 3 M’s. But the one spelled correctly is the REAL one. LOL OR SO EVERYONE BELIEVES and he was right on target when posting will be on various tv shows.

    • On the night of the acquittal, I was really pizzed at Robert Sr. for giving a shout out to the CTH, with their heartfelt thanks to all their friends at the CTH. There were other websites supporting GZ, and his right to self defense, but only the treehouse was thanked, with a “waiving to others.” The CTH tried to disparage GZ’s attorneys. The CTH was not encouraging donations to the defense fund which made the acquittal possible. SD called Robert Sr. and other family members comfortably clueless and naive. I can only say that I am thankful George made his own decisions. Didn’t Robert Sr. take it upon himself to talk with Sonner and Uhrig (sp)? Since George’s arrest Uhrig has been disciplined by the Fla Bar, a fete I didn’t think many could rise to, and that was at least the second time.


  18. In the email, Sundance wrote “O’Mara runs with Mark Nejame, Greg Francis, John Morgan, Charlie Crist, et al. They are his circle of influence – and each has a vested interest in his case with George Zimmerman.”

    What’s his point here? I only know Mark Nejame who by all accounts is a respected lawyer that GZ reached out to for help. Are these lawyers known to be crooks? Why does he think their thoughts on the case would be detrimental to GZ? Have any of them been publicly reprimanded for wrong-doing? Are they all lawyers?

    • John Morgan has a huge lawfirm in Fla. He is a major Democrat fundraiser. I believe Greg FRancis may work for that lawfirm as the go to person for the Pigford shakedown. Ryan Julison also worked for that cause. It really was a shakedown that had gazillions of taxpayer dollars paid to discriminated against black farmers. Thousands more got $50,00 payments even though there weren’t even that many black farmer’s in that time period. The lawyers got the most of the funds, and Gred FRancis was one of them. Charlie Crist was the former Fla. Gov. who went to the Fla. legislature to ask that they approve the5% million dollar payout to Crump, just because he worked with Bondi who lost the Martin Lee Anderson case. Crump represented the Anderson mother in that case. Once the staff was exonerated in the wrongful death of Anderson, it took Crumps ability away from suing the staff members who he would likely have brought lawsuits against personally. They really are a nasty bad lot who gives all lawyers a bad name. That is why SD tied O’Mara in with them. He needed to paint O’Mara as a slime ball by association. Mark NeJame is a TV legal analyst for HLN I believe. Remember SD saying that O’Mara was representing GZ only so he could get a job as a TV legal analyst. O’Mara already was a legal analyst on HLN during the Casey Anthony case.

      • Forgot to add that since Charlie Crist is no longer Fla. Gov. he went to work for the John Morgan lawfirm when he switched from being a Republican, then to an independent, and then to a Democrat.

      • I take it there is no evidence that any of these fellows gained if GZ was convicted?

        What’s the point of mentioning their desired outcome? Did any of them state they hoped he was convicted?

        • Financially probably not, but politically yes. I know you are interested in US politics and there is really no reason why you should if you don’t want to, but that was an election year. Florida is a very important state politically, if you know about our Electoral College this becomes clearer. But to make a long story short, anything that motivates the base is helpful for the candidates you support. That was the case with the TM case, it became very political with many Democratic candidates using the case to their advantage some participating in TM rallies, mentioning him in speeches, etc. This is important because Florida is a 50/50 state the winner of the state could determine the general election, because of this anything that can push the state to one side or other, as the GZ case is useful.

  19. ROFL Nettles, on the thread at CTH about the parents website. I am laughing because of this comment and thinking of the email SD sent you…

    dawndoe says:
    July 26, 2012 at 5:34 pm
    This is egregious. YTZ4MEE, have you personally been able to verify this website to be that of Robert & Gladys? It sounds like it is them, but I would feel much better about it knowing that you, or anyone else from The Treehouse, has vetted the authenticity of this site. Thanks

    ytz4mee says:
    July 26, 2012 at 5:38 pm
    This is the personal website set up, paid for, owned and managed by Robert and Gladys Zimmerman, formerly of Lake Mary, FL, parents of George Zimmerman, who stands accused of second degree murder in the death of Trayvon Martin.
    If it had not been vetted, it wouldn’t have been posted with a link.

    dawndoe says:
    July 26, 2012 at 5:45 pm
    Thanks. I thought as much, but I could not allow myself to simply assume. I hope I have not offended you.

    ytz4mee says:
    July 26, 2012 at 6:04 pm
    No offense taken. We can’t always share what we are aware of on background.


      • NOOOOO!!! I very much believe it to be real (personally) My comment is because of YTZ4mee stating a link wouldn’t be posted with out being vetted first. And I am NOT saying they don’t vet links. Its just funny to me considering the email SD forwarded to Chip, Dman and Nettles. If you haven’t read… it is head spinning crazy. And for what it seems, SD ran with it hook, line and sinker. Too many things been proven lies in the email. That’s what I am laughing at. Sorry, and please don’t feel bad. And I commend you for asking if it were real, and also commend Ytz4mee. Just wonder why SD did his hit and run here about the dumb crass email lol

    • I can not thank you for this.. it sickens me. I am only kidding but those pictures were disgusting.

      Have you noticed any recent references to Obama being reelected. What’s up with that?

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