The state rested it’s case yesterday with a wimper. The Medical Examiner, Mr. Bao gave conflicting and confusing testimony about Trayvon Martin’s autopsy. He told the court that he has no memory of the autopsy but that no one knew more about the autopsy than he did. The day started with the testimony of Sybrina Fulton taking the stand. I was very surprised, knowing she has a PR consultant working with her that she came across as angry as she did rather than coming across emotional from hearing her son screaming.
What a stroke of luck that the defense was able to bring Gladys Zimmerman to the stand at the end of the day which book-ended the testimony of both mothers. Gladys was extremely credible and dignified. George got emotional watching his Uncle testify and the passion and conviction of Uncle Jorge Meza brought out an emotional response in me as well. All of my family and most of my co-workers found Uncle Jorge to be credible. I heard Bill Shaeffer on WFTV say he personally knows Jorge and spoke of his reputation as a deputy officer in Orange County to be excellent. A stronger advocate, George could not have found.
A reporter from Channel 10 news overheard that Crump’s deposition is set for 2pm tomorrow. I also read that Steve Brenton, the FDLE employee, who did a report on Trayvon’s phone was going to be deposed again this weekend.
I’m looking forward to George Zimmerman’s story being told in court this week. I’m certain we will have a verdict acquitting George in the very near future.
It’s only going to get worse for the state. I expect the defense is going to spam the jury with witnesses that testify it’s GZ screaming, for starters.
Interesting, when I was poking around the web for information about slim jims, I found the following pic of a car thief’s tool kit… hmmmm, a screwdriver and a slim jim. Hasn’t O’Mara hinted that the cell phone tower info might put Martin outside of walking distance… the implication seeming to be that he was in a car. We also know they’ve subpoenaed the security camera footage from businesses along the route from RTL to 7-11. (anyone know how to look up police reports about stolen cars in the area that night?)
Remember, too, that the M-DSPD ‘found’ Trayvon in a parking lot with the screwdriver and somehow concluded that the screwdriver was a ‘burglary tool.’ Not a ‘weapon’ or ‘weapon-like’ instrument as school policy might dictate. Did they catch him in the act, and is this how Dunn knew it was a ‘burglary tool’?
At the beginning of yesterday’s testimony the Judge asked if they were able to get into the evidence locker and learned they could not. BDLR stood up and said that as his first 2 witnesses didn’t need to be shown any exhibits so he suggested they go ahead. The first 2 witnesses were Sybrina and Jahvaris. Something changed though and before Sybrina got off the stand, BDLR made it known she was to be recalled when the evidence locker got opened.
Why he called her to the stand and then asked for a sidebar was weird to me. Sybrina looked awkward as hell and gave a few sideways glances to the jury but she tried hard not to look at the lawyers so as not to appear to be eavesdropping and not to look at the jury. BDLR called her to the stand a second time and did the same thing, asked for a sidebar. He wanted her to sit close to the jury for a time but why I don’t get.
Also, not sure why she was asked to identify the button Trayvon was wearing. It obviously wasn’t the plan at the beginning of court, BDLR said no exhibits would be needed but then he did. Why he asked her about the button is a mystery to me.
The only time in the trial the button came up is in George’s non emergency call. He says he has a button on his shirt. Why did the state need Sybrina to identify that button before her testimony was finished? Can anyone give me a scenario to explain it?
Also, not sure why she was asked to identify the button Trayvon was wearing. It obviously wasn’t the plan at the beginning of court, BDLR said no exhibits would be needed but then he did. Why he asked her about the button is a mystery to me.
The only time in the trial the button came up is in George’s non emergency call. He says he has a button on his shirt. Why did the state need Sybrina to identify that button before her testimony was finished? Can anyone give me a scenario to explain it?
I suppose it could be part of their narrative: Zimmerman apprehended and attempted to detain Martin. Zimmerman grabbed Martin by the hoodie with one hand, and shot him with the other hand. They’ll try to say that the trajectory of the bullet combined with the location of the button will prove that Zimmerman had grasped the hoodie and pulled it toward himself before the shot.
Chip ~ it’s a good thing, pathologist & super star expert Dr. Vincent Di maeio will testify as to the trajectory of the shot & the gun shot wound, he will dispel any propaganda still being promoted by the TM supporters. Besides being a high profile expert testifying in hundreds of trials & high profile cases, he is an excellent expert & likable. Despite the miserable performance of Dr. Bao, Dr. Di will undo any positives the state thought they gained.
I remain curious about the “time line expert,” I don’t know the identification of the person & I am curious as to whom is subject to recall, my guess would be DD/Precious/RJ & Serino.
I’m thinking it was done for the same reason he had Sybrina explain the tattoos on TM… great grandma, grandma, mom, cousin. It was a way to introduce positive character evidence (loved his family) without opening the door to negative character evidence.
Now, of course, this would’ve had to have been completely orchestrated (conspired) with Sybrina beforehand… and again I’m left wondering at what point does prepping a witness cross the line into coaching a witness.
I wonder how many of the Moms on the jury think it’s alright for Trayvon to have tattoos at his age, no matter what they were.
He posted a picture of the arm tattoo in 2010 so he was at least 15 when he got that one.
Tracy’s neck tat has been replaced with praying hands (to match TM’s?)
And Sybrina’s now infamous boob tat seems to be gone… modest amount of cleavage in her recent outfits and no tat visible.
This is another example of how, as Stately Mike puts it, just how upside down and backwards the behaviors in this case are. It’s usually the defendant trying to clean up his or her appearance, but here it’s the Fulton/Martin clan and even Rachel who are being transformed.
Is this something that O’Mara could (or even should) address with them on the stand in front of the jury? If for no other reason than to bring it to the jury’s attention that it’s all an act of deception undertaken after hiring a personal injury attorney and a PR specialist…
Sybrina, Tracy, and Crump all need to be asked if they’ve made any donations or contributions to Vereen’s political career… personally or through any of the various charities, foundations, or businesses between them.
Maybe in the civil trial is a better place. Right now the priority is the criminal charge.
Perhaps this is the time to bring it up. With the world watching, will there be this kind of attention in the civil trial?
Nettles – It’s not likely a Civil Suit would bring much attention in GZ’s case imo, the Courtroom used for KC wss twice the size of the one being used in GZ’s case. KC’s case was so big because it involved a 2 1/2 yr. old child, KC lied to the Detectives, LE, Texas Equisearch & she blamed the abduction on “Zanny the Nanny, Zenaida Gonzales”. (Texas Equasearch & Zenaida G have pending Civil law suits.) KC was too convicted of 4 counts of lying in her trial to the authorities angering the people of Fla. when thousands volunteered to physically search for Caylee.
KC’s headaches are on going & followed closely since she walked in a murder case, her civil suit is sensational because she wants to file for bankruptsy & have ALL the Judgements & pending Civil Suits dismissed through bankruptsy. THEN! She plans to write a book or tell all & make tons of $$$$$ & not have to pay any Civil Suits. Theres a reason she is the most hated person in America, that’s never going to change imo.
If GZ is found guilty, there won’t likely be any lawsuits as there won’t be any money. If GZ is found NOT Guilty, he stands a chance of the Beasley re-couping some money. GZ, unlike KC, won’t have pro bono attorneys defending him in a Civil Suit if he is liable. Unlike KC, she has had PRO BONO Civil Attorneys defend her for years. KC had an appeal on the lying & those attorney’s were PRO BONO. The Beasley group will be paid first if NBC puts out any money, then I assume MOM/West & outstanding legal bills, then GZ if there is anything left.
Don West, in his opening statements made the observation that it was highly unusual that George cooperated with the police with no lawyer present, yet half of the witnesses had lawyered up. The jurors already heard from DD that she was first contacted by Crump, the lawyer for the Martin family, and that her interview with BDLR was at Sybrina’s home, and that the Martin parents were present, as well as “their attorney’s” including Crump. I think the jury has absorbed the fact that the Martin’s lawyered up, and that a prosecutor, the bald headed guy, went to the home of the mother of TM to take her statements. I refuse to believe that the jurors would not see the problems with conducting a prosecution interview in that manner. Don’t most people think that these types of interviews are normally done in a much more professional and credible manner?
I don’t know how it will be done, but, I have faith and confidence that O’Mara/West will introduce arguments, in their own brilliant but unobtrusive way that the Martin family has a vested interest in the outcome of the case, and that it has little to do with Justice for Trayvon.
I believe that O’Mara/West may have been reluctant to go in some directions at first, like destroying Martin’s reputation, but, with the state’s obvious tactic in going for the kill at all costs, the defense team will do as Mike McDaniel has indicated, they will mow the grass as we all watch some real brilliance in the courtroom.
I also disagree with the talking heads that the defense will bring on only a few witnesses, and that they will rest in a few days. No, no. They will go all in to defend the best interests of their client in every way they possibly can. West’s cross of Bao yesterday, when Nelson seemed to have lost all control of her courtroom, I believe is an indication of just where they will try to go next week. No harm in getting Nelson’s insanity in her rulings on the record for an appeal. It is simply amazing that she allows DD to disrespect her and the courtroom, and then she allows Bao to disrespect her and courtroom etiquette, but she shouts at West to go sit down, and tells O’Mara he only has a certain amount of time to cross a witness.
One more thing. It was fascinating that in the Richardson portion of the trial yesterday, Bao admitted that he and BDLR had met the day before, July 4, to discuss the Toxicology report. Bao wanted the report in, and Bernie wanted the report kept out is how I read that. That will be critical when prosecutorial misconduct charges are brought against the Corey’s state office, with all those involved in the misconduct. It will also likely come up when Nelson is overturned by the DCA on a laundry list of reversible errors, the main one being that she, the judge, ruled to keep exculpatory evidence from being given to the jury. .
Bao definitely seemed concerned about what he was being asked not mention on the stand (tox report)… he even brought up the matter of perjury himself, and I get the sense he probably had the same conversation and addressed the same concerns with BDLR the day before at their private meeting.
Since I am not watching the streaming, I find this a very interesting point. Bao was hostile to the defense. Bao had notes and it would seem that the purpose of those notes was to hide things.
The fact that dumb Debbie said the notes were to be destroyed is not something that should happen indicates a very high level of malfeasance.
Will Bao turn against the State. Was he hostile because he was afraid?
My Mom always said no one could get into heaven who had a tattoo.
That is the point. If they try to get across that positive yet false information about the wannabe gang member and thug Traydemark Martin, they open the door about what he was really like.
SD has a good post on that button….
…and I’m wondering why O’Mara didn’t take the bait when BDLR specifically brought Sybrina back on the stand to identify the button?
I’m asking tweeters to Re-Tweet (RT) to spread the word and hopefully add pressure.
The media has been silent on the fact that while the Martin family demanded a trial they refused to help bring the truth forward. Not giving a sample of Trayvon’s voice is suspicious to me. They know if they provide one, it will be clearer as to who was screaming.
Daaaaa…thanks
Nettles – in addition, the assinine Tracy Martin wouldn’t give up the pin # on TM’s cell phone which would have been on his bill just as my pin # is on my ATT internet bill & cell bill.
Tracy proved to be too much of a risk for the State to put on as a witness because he couldn’t withstand the cross exam from MOM/West. The State may call Tracy to use as a rebuttal witness, again claiming that was TM screaming. MOM stated at being surprised “some family members didn’t testify.” imo, so much emphasis has been put on the 911 call, someone from TM’s family will testify imo. If this should happen, Tracy wouldn’t be cross examined. Of course the Defense can call Tracy as their witness, if they don’t, imo, we’ll hear from him in the States rebuttal.
Definition of Prosecution Rebuttal: Rebuttal evidence is evidence that tends to explain, refute, counteract, or disprove …
That and the phone….they have nothing to hide!!!!!!!!!!
This is off topic but amazing to me. A passenger on a plane that crash landed in San Francisco has tweeted out a picture of being evacuated from the plane!
Cute but inaccurate because the argument would be that it was the other guy screaming your name to get you to stop hitting him. Why would you scream your own name after all?
They used to tell women to cry FIRE or BOMB instead of Rape or Murder because more people would be vested in something that could affect them. Most attacks happen with quickness and agility completely overtaking the victim by surprise so to scream at all would take some amount of staying aware. The fact that George was aware and conscious through all of it, doesn’t mean the rest of us would be that lucky if it was happening to us. Although I don’t think George was truly aware of the amount of danger he was in.
The pain from sudden injury doesn’t begin until some time after the event. If you have heard battle stories where men lost some body parts and were not aware of it.
Also, as badly as the injuries were downplayed by the medical personnel, the police, the investigators and the PA, it actually worked in George’s favor to believe and heal himself. Sometimes making something more of it, does more harm than good. I know a parent who actually ignores his crying toddler when he falls or scrapes his knee. The child surprisingly enough stops crying because he figures its probably not too bad and gets on with whatever he was doing.
Quick question, if I may. Where can I find transcript (assuming no audio available) of Tracy under oath (if at all) re: how Trayvon got to Sanford? Ty.
To get a full flavor of what the family was saying in late March/ early April 2012 to the State’s investigators and BDLR, see page 9 (Stephen the cousin’s statement). Page 28, a joint interview on March 26th by Tracy and Sybrina. Page 32 Brandy Green’s statement to Guy, BDLR and O’Steen on March 27th, Page 36 is Rachel Jeantel’s interview on April 2nd which indicates it was taped, Page 37 is Sybrina Fulton’s statement given the same day they interviewed Rachel in her home, Page 39 is the statement taken from Chad at school and you’ll note he contradicts his mom’s statement and finally page 40 is Tracy’s statement where he corrects the misinformation he and Sybrina gave a week earlier about the last day she saw Trayvon and when he went to Sanford.
If you are still looking is in the summaries from the first of second discovery drops. There was some discussion on it because Tracy had stated to SPD that he drove TM half way on Tuesday, but Sybrina had said it was a Wednesday. Then on the second interview with FDLE Tracy said it was definitely Tuesday, but did not amend to say that TM took the bus.
Ty for the corection. Is that correction from tracy in this file or another? Just checking.
Nettles, a huge ty.
So, basically, they likely had brandi pick up tray who swung at a bus driver and hid it. That is why stephans tweet as mr_4dat “you no tell me you swung on bus driver” is the date tray took the bus. He texted deedee “you shoulda been on da bus :)” that very same night.
But did he text stephan? I do. Only the defense knows…i wonder if that is why brandi had to meet tray in the first place. Unless that was planned and a coincidence tray did what he did.
Read booby’s testimony. He gave an UNSOLICITED statement of how he never saw Tray smoke Marijuana. Then there is this from the night before (tweeted by him in March 2012)
Coincidence? Also it’s ambiguous who got high that night, technically. It also reminds me of how Tracy told 911 on missing person’s call, unsolicited, how ‘responsible’ his nephew is.
This family had time to plan their story to Cover their you know whats. The q is did the lawyer help with this or did he come on board because of this and then took advantage of it? We’ll likely never know. I will say this. After mid march, these type of tweets seemed to have stopped.
You should also read the esquire article – it’s so hilariously pathetically fake “Boobie and Tray would play video games, talk about girls and sleep in the same bunk bed”. Then there is THIS. Good grief. B.S, meet reality.
Here is the link to the esquire article for those who haven’t seen it.
Some samples of traybog disconnect I am seeing today AFTER the state has rested 1) wait until the state introduces GZ texts and emails 2) wait until the state introduces GPS data from Zimmermans ankle bracelet. 3) wait until the state presents the FDLE investigators finding.
That is not surprising at all. They either don’t have a clue as to how the judicial system works in this country, or they have decided to ignore it. How do you think Sharpton keeps on like the energizer bunny, race baiting every chance he gets. They could care less that he has been proven wrong over and over.
A few months ago Tawana Brawley was found working in VA. under a different name. The judge ordered her pay to be garnished until she pays the awards that a jury gave to the people she claimed falsely that raped her. She had never paid the first dime on those awards. I suspect she will now up and move to another state, and use yet a different name in order to escape those payments.
It has been interesting for me that some of the talk radio hosts have talked about the Zimmerman case. They have been in favor of Zimmerman. They open up their lines to callers, and 99% of the callers have been black males who have argued that George followed Martin when he was told not to. A black female yesterday screamed her brians out that a “child” had been shot and killed, and it doesn’t matter at all why George shot him, he was just a child. The black male callers have been almost 100% in favoring TM. One guy called and said that he had heard the evidence in the trial so far, and that yes he agreed that it favored the defense. Despite that he said that Zimmerman should still be charged with murder 2, and that if he was a juror he would definately vote to convict. A lawyer called in right after him and said that it was the previous caller who really scared him the most. He knows the evidence but would vote to convict GZ despite the evidence.
Any rationality or reasoning among the black population, even some who are highly educated, and are in fact lawyers, cannot go against the racial issue of their fellow bros. and the laws be damned.
This is taught to kids is some schools, and becoming more prevalent, the white privilege movement that you see in some Universities around the country are a result. The main problem with it aside from the straight out racism of it, is that it is a zero sum game, it does not provide any solutions just an excuse/explanation for black racism and lack success in America and around the world. In a sense it is the polar opposite of the “white power”
This is good Bori, thanks for sharing. I’ve been sufficiently brainwashed in this at the Universities. One white Professor demanded activism from her students in that we should actually seek out minorities to educate them that there is racism against them. The tragedy is that blacks are dominating the culture with “Black children learn at church that it’s good to clap, speak loudly and be a bit raucous. But doing the same thing at school, where 72% of teachers are white and may be unfamiliar with such customs, will get them in trouble.”
And the stoic, discipline of monastic religious types, military types, Amish types, and the melancholy old cultural types depicted in movies like “Babette’s feast” is completely discredited by young people. Your child can no more say Winnie the Pooh, and someone smack them down with, “you mean Winnie the Shit don’t you?” The worst thing about Jantel and her generation is their inability to recognize the beauty in other cultures and learn from others. She makes her own morality, where its okay to lie under oath, yet feel guilt over all sorts of other things, and progs cry about what a beautiful higher form of morality this is, so there is no burden on the Jantel’s to join the rest of the world.
Oh, as I was talking about stoicity and discipline, this is exactly why I put the picture of the police dogs looking at the little kitten go by, on my blog. Its the kind of mental discipline that George showed, right down to when he used swear words.
It was easy to recognize the resignation in his words, if you’ve been around that sort of discipline, yet people presume a hateful angry racist in combat boots, jumping out of the truck with gun at the ready. Manolo too, expected some expressive emotion from George, very surprisingly since Asians do understand quiet mental discipline, but he didn’t understand George’s
I like the taunts that the judge isn’t going to let Trayvon’s drug use, fights, gun in so there ha, ha, ha. They believe justice will be served by hiding the truth.
I bet the traynuts had a lovely weekend doxing GZ uncle looking for dirt
No doubt. I expect they’ll be insulting and belittling him soon if they haven’t already started.
Trent is lurking at the Zimmerman trial and has made some overt threats on his twitter tsaw33
Geesh, the guy is an obsessed stalker. Seriously. Who else does something like that?
It’s like he’s casing the courthouse for his followers… and zooming in on the address and stating “This is where your life ends.”
These folks aren’t gonna be satisfied until someone else is dead…
How is it $ybrina Fulton cant identify her son's voice on video from his phone but knows it's his voice on 911 call? http://t.co/YBksDlERX7
After Jorge Meza testified, did you note that Kelly Simms was between the doors? Is Shellie Zimmerman the next witness?
From what you are saying, it may be possible that Shellie may be the next witness. Personally I would put Shellie on the stand at the end to make an impact on the jury with that last testimony.
It should have been obvious to all that on the first day when BDLR argued to have them removed from the courtroom it had much more to do with the optics than anything else. Would the jurors see that George had no family members in the courtroom to support him, therefore even his family didn’t support his actions? We know that BDLR and Corey are playing the evil card everywhere they possibly can. It also added to the media optics as they focused heavily on Tracy and Sybrina each and every day. What they were wearing, what expressions they made. Who was sitting by the Martin family members such as Corey. GZ’s family was not there, and consequently were never mentioned.
I would put Tracy Martin along with Serino and the other two witnesses to the “not my son” fiasco last
Right. That’s the video where Crump feeds that to her. I was just watching that earlier today. I am trying to compile a list of this in an easy to digest format. If anybody has any suggestions…
Not sure what trial Jonathan “tinfoil hat” Capehart was watching
Zorn and I are seeing pretty much eye to eye on everything. Of the hundreds of posts I’ve written, they are all very similar.
I do think Zorn’s initial criticism of George was a little unfair, as it was a bit of a lose-lose question by Hannity about the regrets. If he said how much he regretted his decision to use deadly force, it would definitely have been used against him by the Trayvonites. In fact considering how ridiculously terrible their case it, it probably would have been their top piece of evidence against him.
But I also didn’t particularly care for George’s answer either.
The other accounts of George’s regrets during the police interview and by witnesses after the event, I was able to give him the benefit of the doubt,
Agreed, it was very awkward but not hard to understand given the choices under the intense circumstances of that interview. GZ was desperate to show that he was not a racist monster and needed donations.
I read your posts at TL, and naturally find your perspective sane and reasoned. I am disgusted at the unwillingness of so many to put themselves in the place of being attacked as GZ was. Talkleft has a core group of such unreasonable righteous lefties.
GZ does not regret saving himself from death or serious brain injury. He knows he is responsible for killing TM, he did the unspeakable because no one stopped TM. Unlike Zorn I very much believe GZ that TM said ‘your gonna die tonight MoFo” I also believe TM said ” you got a problem” when he first contacted George. I have heard those exact phrases in my hood, in fact, one of my neighbors a middle age woman was threatened with that same statement after testifying in court against a family of drug dealers. “You got a problem” is standard hood talk to any white person who happens to do a double take on teens with an attitude. This incident was not a fight, it was a battery by TM.
I do not believe GZ exaggerated anything that night when interviewed other than the number of blows to the head, my son did the same when he was attacked. Some of the blows are not as damaging as others, the beating blurs your thinking as time stands still, you wonder when the attack will stop, you think you are going to go unconscious, GZ could not even protect his face since his arms were pinned down.
I think Zorn and Merritt are way too soft on TM, and way too soft on the brutality of thug culture, good lefties preserving their status.
On the matter of “it was God’s plan”, if you are a believer and accept that nature is God’s creation and you understand the body’s natural response to fear is fight or flight, than explaining the instinct to take profound action to protect your life is God’s plan. Of course he regretted that TM died from the gunshot, he intended to stop TM not kill him as he was trained to do. Early on when GZ family felt they could they tried to express sorrow. As Robert jr has explained GZ become a very somber person right after the incident, but he does not regret defending his life. GZ is in a impossible situation of damned if he does damned if he doesn’t. It is too easy for journalist and pundits to second guess GZ, after all he is just a doofus as Zorn tells us, not a 26 year old who has been placed on the altar of black rage and retribution.
Who is going to order an investigation into what Crump did in hiding Rachel Jeantel until he got the 911 tapes released?
Nettles – sadly, I don’t think anything is going to happen to Crump, imo, it was witness tampering at the least. I read an article last week in which a DA blatantly filed fraudulent subpoenas, lied, & set up a defendant in order to get a conviction. The DA ONLY lost his license to practice law for 180 days, or 6 months. Hardly a consequence.
Baez was supposed to be brought up on sanctions after KC’s case, & nothing ever materialized, I could never figure out WHY he didn’t suffer any consequences. Bill Sheaffer cleared that up last week, he stated, “if GZ is found NOT GUILTY, the sanctions will go away just as they did for Baez.” That isn’t a remedy for the injustices, but it did happen in KC’s case. imo, Corey/BDLR both need to retire. Sadly too, they have endlessly been accused of the same behavior for years & nothing ever happened to them, no repercussions, imo, they are too politically connected. This is not the first time Corey/BDLR have been accused of the very same behavior, I read several grievances defendants have claimed in the past, but Corey/BDLR have skated every time.
I find it absolutely bizarre how many Trayvon worshippers are still clinging to the “Trayvon never touched GZ” and “Gz injured himself” meme
those people are idiots.
Now back to a point made by a tweeter. Yes it is true, GZ never said that TM said “what are you following me for”. It was Crump who said that. GZ said that TM said “Do you have a problem?” and GZ said “No” and TM said “you do now” and then he punched GZ in the face.
I honestly believe that is what actually took place. I do not believe Rachel Jeantel. I think she was given a script of what to say. She might have been on the phone but not at the time of the assault. She is lying about the assault on George Zimmerman.
She may have also not been on the phone with Tray or he lied to her. The only way to construct a logical conclusion is to look at all of his texts with her and get a profile of if he wanted to impress her or not. Technically, I say *yes* because of 2-21-12 “You shoulda been on da bus :)” which is when I think he tried to assault the driver.
If you look at all texts re: fights etc, I wonder if he was trying to impress one person in particular. It makes sense for so many reasons. And it may be why Rachel feels guilt. She may not even have needed a script, just a little ‘assistance’ as she creates her own b.s. to feed her guilt. It may be why she is also such a heavy drinker.
Exactly. Why did she have guilt?
Also, is she involved in a gang?
Trayvon was a definite gang wannabe, so how did he meet Rachel? Is she a gang chick? Did he see her as an easy lay?
I think she was on the phone at the time that TM punched GZ in the nose. I think that is when the phone hung up and she heard nothing after she heard TM say “Well you got a problem now!” ….. and she thought it was just a fight.
Rachel’s phone records say her call ended at 7:15:43 and 28 seconds later Jenna Lauer (W11) called 911 and we hear GZ’s screams in the background.
I believe Crump knew about Rachel on March 1st or 2nd and I think she didn’t attend his funeral b/c she was freaked out to hear he died a minute after her call ended. Rachel said her friend texted her an article on Tuesday, Feb. 29th that showed her proof Trayvon had died and she asked them what time did he die and she checked her records and learned she was the last one. I think that’s a lie. The times of the calls were not reported so her friend could not have told her what time the article said Trayvon died. Nope, it was Crump who told her.
This is why Crump filed to get those calls released. He needed them to help craft Rachel narrative on what was said on the phone.
Rachel was on the phone with Trayvon when he circled George’s car and she knows that happened and she knows what Travyon said. GZ didn’t hear what he said, he rolled up the window and continued to talk to Sean.
The parents of Trayvon Martin knew the truth of what happened in the early days in talking with Rachel but they destroyed George Zimmerman’s life and made his family live in hiding and fear for over 16 months. While it’s sad they lost their child, there is no excuse for them to knowingly spread lies so that they can gain financially.
I’m looking forward to the truth being told.
This is a great post but something is throwing a red flag at me. You mention she said she was told on the 29th. I had the impression she stated (not sure how) she found out the next day at school. I probably imagined that and confused what happened on Twitter when friends found out the next day (all saying it was a fight – odd). Even the ‘girlfriend’ of Trayvon, whose name I won’t give but was featured in an arcile you will find on his site if you search ‘who dat?’.
Man, this defense needs to fly you first class to their courtroom.
Your memory is good. She did say she found out the next day. She said that to Crump in the March 19th interview in clip 6 she says:
Clip 6: Source:
Crump: OK, Well, I think that’s everything. Uh, I, I want to say on behalf of his mom and daddy and his family it means so much you sharing to us what you all talked about the last time that he was alive. You were, the records confirm that you were the last person to talk to him alive and that you heard part of the altercation between what happened just minutes before he was killed.
W8: Yeah
Crump: Okay. And so, we are keeping you in our prayers. And when you talk to your mother, if at any point, uh, you know after a little while, where you say you uh, come on and we, your face will be grayed out and stuff, it’s one thing to hear it’s another thing to just see any kind of image uh, and you tell that story just like you told us earlier today which just put it in perspective for us. He was just trying to get home uh, and it started raining. Is that pretty,
W8: Yeah.
Crump: that’s pretty accurate?
W8: Yeah.
Crump: Okay. Um, Well, thank you so much and tell your mother thank you and uh Sybrina, uh Mr. Martin uh, well his mom and dad, they’ll call next week. Oh, I did want to say this. Um, I understand that you can’t come to the wake because you had to go to the hospital. Can you tell me about that?
W8: He didn’t call back so I thought, okay, he done knocked the phone on the grass, cause I thought it was a fight. And then, and then the next day
Abrupt End to Clip 6 =========================================
But on the stand, during cross-examination she said she heard rumors at school on Monday and didn’t believe them and then on Tuesday a friend texted her an article.
I am so looking forward to the time line expert lay this out for the jury.
The critical point is when the phone went dead. What I am also getting at is the extra information provided by Rachel and she could not have heard anything. It was stuff that strains credulty.
Can we really know if she heard any words? Or did she change the words that she heard to the ones that Crump told her to say? Now that is a serious question!!!
I’ll remind you that after she heard a bump, in the March 19th interview she never heard anything after that. “The phone just shut-off” In BDLR’s interview she says the same thing but BDLR pushes for more. So she says might have heard a little get off.
In her interview with BDLR we hear her say “Trayvon bum…somebody bumped Trayvon” See 11:28 mark
Yes Nettles, that is exactly what I am referring to. She never heard those things because the phone was shut off.
Also, she first said that Trayvon bumped, then changed it to the other person bumped Trayvon.
It was the fact that BDLR pushed for further information and she went further, after the phone had shut off, that has me not believing her story.
Just beyond that point she said she couldn’t hear Trayvon. West played the part in court and asked her what she was saying. She grabbed at her bangs and put her hand over her face. She was busted. But then a recess got called, she left the stand for the break and when she came back she changed it to she could hear Trayvon say get off. Someone coached her during the recess I think.
You are keeping a better eye on the actual trial. I did not know there had been the recess. Yes, I believe she was coached during that time by (Crump, Vereen on behalf of Crump?) or perhaps by BDLR. It does not matter who did the coaching because she was coming off as being coached. The same with the overnight thing. She came back with a different attitude.
I am waiting now to see if West recalls her to the stand. She has a lot more to tell.
How come this is not the face of the woman who took the stand? Is this the face of someone who was first thought to be “DD”?
I thought the DD in court had an “interesting” body type – when exiting the court room you could see she was somewhat wide from the waist down, but she seemed rather tall, so that may have been proportionate. But her chest, face, and rather large neck were so out of proportion. In other words, her over-weight seemed to mainly be from the waist up, not a general all-body obesity.
I agree with those who think she started adding on “things she heard” – but if there *were* a “little get off, get off”, it certainly sounds like something GZ would say after being punched and then pushed around as TM tried to get him down for the ground and pound.
I would love it if MOM found the busdriver. I so want those scheming parents to be exposed. They isn’t a place in h*ll for someone who tries to put an innocent man in jail, exposes his family to threats and disrupts their whole lives, and bears responsibility for all the innocent white people who have been attacked by gangs of blacks as “justice for Trayvon”. THey can get away with a lot – they’re grieving, it was their “opinion” it was TM’s voice, etc – but if they can get them on the coverup of the fighting hx, lying on the stand, etc, maybe they can get in trouble.
Same here. I can’t wait for the truth to be told either. I can’t imagine that the defense’s timeline won’t account for pretty much every second of George’s whereabouts via the call records so that there is NO DOUBT in the jurors’ minds that George is telling the truth and that his few inconsistencies are not lies.
Though, I do worry that there is someone like this on the jury.
1) the “God’s plan” was not GZ finest moment. But as I already noted above, it was a lose/lose question.
2) I disagree completely that Trayvon “deserved to die”. I think approx 10-15% of the hardcore GZ supporters may think this. If Horowitz wants to make the point TM didn’t deserve to die, I don’t particularly mind.
Many conservatives would rather not pick this fight, that’s for sure. Ex Fox News. It’s not good for the status quo.
Horowitz is wrong on the insignificant injuries and the defense is likely to put medical information about head trauma forward.
Horowitz is late to the game and missing plenty of evidence is drawing his conclusion.
Agreed, 100%.
When Sybrina said her little thug was in heaven i would have said “objection…calls for speculation”…..but then again…im kind of an asshole LOL
This is the transcript I’m talking about. At 2:10 of this video, Mr. West gets into it with her. She clearly said she couldn’t hear Trayvon. On the stand she said, that’s why I was calling his name, Trayvon, Trayvon. The judge wouldn’t allow it to be played in front of the jury and she dismissed them right before the 2:10 mark. Shawn’s cues it up at 2:11:20…what do you think she said? Could she hear Trayvon or she couldn’t hear Trayvon.
How is it legal for the judge to keep allowing her to avoid perjury? Will the defense use this for their appeal?
I cannot see why people are not making a bigger deal of this.
I think she was saying I coulda heard Trayvon, as if not totally and then quickly became sure it was Trayvon.
The state rested it’s case yesterday with a wimper. The Medical Examiner, Mr. Bao gave conflicting and confusing testimony about Trayvon Martin’s autopsy. He told the court that he has no memory of the autopsy but that no one knew more about the autopsy than he did. The day started with the testimony of Sybrina Fulton taking the stand. I was very surprised, knowing she has a PR consultant working with her that she came across as angry as she did rather than coming across emotional from hearing her son screaming.
kNOw Truth, kNOw Justice 
It’s only going to get worse for the state. I expect the defense is going to spam the jury with witnesses that testify it’s GZ screaming, for starters.
Interesting, when I was poking around the web for information about slim jims, I found the following pic of a car thief’s tool kit… hmmmm, a screwdriver and a slim jim. Hasn’t O’Mara hinted that the cell phone tower info might put Martin outside of walking distance… the implication seeming to be that he was in a car. We also know they’ve subpoenaed the security camera footage from businesses along the route from RTL to 7-11. (anyone know how to look up police reports about stolen cars in the area that night?)
Remember, too, that the M-DSPD ‘found’ Trayvon in a parking lot with the screwdriver and somehow concluded that the screwdriver was a ‘burglary tool.’ Not a ‘weapon’ or ‘weapon-like’ instrument as school policy might dictate. Did they catch him in the act, and is this how Dunn knew it was a ‘burglary tool’?
At the beginning of yesterday’s testimony the Judge asked if they were able to get into the evidence locker and learned they could not. BDLR stood up and said that as his first 2 witnesses didn’t need to be shown any exhibits so he suggested they go ahead. The first 2 witnesses were Sybrina and Jahvaris. Something changed though and before Sybrina got off the stand, BDLR made it known she was to be recalled when the evidence locker got opened.
Why he called her to the stand and then asked for a sidebar was weird to me. Sybrina looked awkward as hell and gave a few sideways glances to the jury but she tried hard not to look at the lawyers so as not to appear to be eavesdropping and not to look at the jury. BDLR called her to the stand a second time and did the same thing, asked for a sidebar. He wanted her to sit close to the jury for a time but why I don’t get.
Also, not sure why she was asked to identify the button Trayvon was wearing. It obviously wasn’t the plan at the beginning of court, BDLR said no exhibits would be needed but then he did. Why he asked her about the button is a mystery to me.
The only time in the trial the button came up is in George’s non emergency call. He says he has a button on his shirt. Why did the state need Sybrina to identify that button before her testimony was finished? Can anyone give me a scenario to explain it?
I suppose it could be part of their narrative: Zimmerman apprehended and attempted to detain Martin. Zimmerman grabbed Martin by the hoodie with one hand, and shot him with the other hand. They’ll try to say that the trajectory of the bullet combined with the location of the button will prove that Zimmerman had grasped the hoodie and pulled it toward himself before the shot.
Chip ~ it’s a good thing, pathologist & super star expert Dr. Vincent Di maeio will testify as to the trajectory of the shot & the gun shot wound, he will dispel any propaganda still being promoted by the TM supporters. Besides being a high profile expert testifying in hundreds of trials & high profile cases, he is an excellent expert & likable. Despite the miserable performance of Dr. Bao, Dr. Di will undo any positives the state thought they gained.
I remain curious about the “time line expert,” I don’t know the identification of the person & I am curious as to whom is subject to recall, my guess would be DD/Precious/RJ & Serino.
I’m thinking it was done for the same reason he had Sybrina explain the tattoos on TM… great grandma, grandma, mom, cousin. It was a way to introduce positive character evidence (loved his family) without opening the door to negative character evidence.
Now, of course, this would’ve had to have been completely orchestrated (conspired) with Sybrina beforehand… and again I’m left wondering at what point does prepping a witness cross the line into coaching a witness.
I wonder how many of the Moms on the jury think it’s alright for Trayvon to have tattoos at his age, no matter what they were.
He posted a picture of the arm tattoo in 2010 so he was at least 15 when he got that one.
Both Tracy and Sybrina have tattoos
https://twitter.com/DukeButt/status/353583698811166720
“Both Tracy and Sybrina have tattoos”
Tracy’s neck tat has been replaced with praying hands (to match TM’s?)
And Sybrina’s now infamous boob tat seems to be gone… modest amount of cleavage in her recent outfits and no tat visible.
This is another example of how, as Stately Mike puts it, just how upside down and backwards the behaviors in this case are. It’s usually the defendant trying to clean up his or her appearance, but here it’s the Fulton/Martin clan and even Rachel who are being transformed.
Is this something that O’Mara could (or even should) address with them on the stand in front of the jury? If for no other reason than to bring it to the jury’s attention that it’s all an act of deception undertaken after hiring a personal injury attorney and a PR specialist…
Sybrina, Tracy, and Crump all need to be asked if they’ve made any donations or contributions to Vereen’s political career… personally or through any of the various charities, foundations, or businesses between them.
Maybe in the civil trial is a better place. Right now the priority is the criminal charge.
Perhaps this is the time to bring it up. With the world watching, will there be this kind of attention in the civil trial?
Nettles – It’s not likely a Civil Suit would bring much attention in GZ’s case imo, the Courtroom used for KC wss twice the size of the one being used in GZ’s case. KC’s case was so big because it involved a 2 1/2 yr. old child, KC lied to the Detectives, LE, Texas Equisearch & she blamed the abduction on “Zanny the Nanny, Zenaida Gonzales”. (Texas Equasearch & Zenaida G have pending Civil law suits.) KC was too convicted of 4 counts of lying in her trial to the authorities angering the people of Fla. when thousands volunteered to physically search for Caylee.
KC’s headaches are on going & followed closely since she walked in a murder case, her civil suit is sensational because she wants to file for bankruptsy & have ALL the Judgements & pending Civil Suits dismissed through bankruptsy. THEN! She plans to write a book or tell all & make tons of $$$$$ & not have to pay any Civil Suits. Theres a reason she is the most hated person in America, that’s never going to change imo.
If GZ is found guilty, there won’t likely be any lawsuits as there won’t be any money. If GZ is found NOT Guilty, he stands a chance of the Beasley re-couping some money. GZ, unlike KC, won’t have pro bono attorneys defending him in a Civil Suit if he is liable. Unlike KC, she has had PRO BONO Civil Attorneys defend her for years. KC had an appeal on the lying & those attorney’s were PRO BONO. The Beasley group will be paid first if NBC puts out any money, then I assume MOM/West & outstanding legal bills, then GZ if there is anything left.
Don West, in his opening statements made the observation that it was highly unusual that George cooperated with the police with no lawyer present, yet half of the witnesses had lawyered up. The jurors already heard from DD that she was first contacted by Crump, the lawyer for the Martin family, and that her interview with BDLR was at Sybrina’s home, and that the Martin parents were present, as well as “their attorney’s” including Crump. I think the jury has absorbed the fact that the Martin’s lawyered up, and that a prosecutor, the bald headed guy, went to the home of the mother of TM to take her statements. I refuse to believe that the jurors would not see the problems with conducting a prosecution interview in that manner. Don’t most people think that these types of interviews are normally done in a much more professional and credible manner?
I don’t know how it will be done, but, I have faith and confidence that O’Mara/West will introduce arguments, in their own brilliant but unobtrusive way that the Martin family has a vested interest in the outcome of the case, and that it has little to do with Justice for Trayvon.
I believe that O’Mara/West may have been reluctant to go in some directions at first, like destroying Martin’s reputation, but, with the state’s obvious tactic in going for the kill at all costs, the defense team will do as Mike McDaniel has indicated, they will mow the grass as we all watch some real brilliance in the courtroom.
I also disagree with the talking heads that the defense will bring on only a few witnesses, and that they will rest in a few days. No, no. They will go all in to defend the best interests of their client in every way they possibly can. West’s cross of Bao yesterday, when Nelson seemed to have lost all control of her courtroom, I believe is an indication of just where they will try to go next week. No harm in getting Nelson’s insanity in her rulings on the record for an appeal. It is simply amazing that she allows DD to disrespect her and the courtroom, and then she allows Bao to disrespect her and courtroom etiquette, but she shouts at West to go sit down, and tells O’Mara he only has a certain amount of time to cross a witness.
One more thing. It was fascinating that in the Richardson portion of the trial yesterday, Bao admitted that he and BDLR had met the day before, July 4, to discuss the Toxicology report. Bao wanted the report in, and Bernie wanted the report kept out is how I read that. That will be critical when prosecutorial misconduct charges are brought against the Corey’s state office, with all those involved in the misconduct. It will also likely come up when Nelson is overturned by the DCA on a laundry list of reversible errors, the main one being that she, the judge, ruled to keep exculpatory evidence from being given to the jury. .
Bao definitely seemed concerned about what he was being asked not mention on the stand (tox report)… he even brought up the matter of perjury himself, and I get the sense he probably had the same conversation and addressed the same concerns with BDLR the day before at their private meeting.
Since I am not watching the streaming, I find this a very interesting point. Bao was hostile to the defense. Bao had notes and it would seem that the purpose of those notes was to hide things.
The fact that dumb Debbie said the notes were to be destroyed is not something that should happen indicates a very high level of malfeasance.
Will Bao turn against the State. Was he hostile because he was afraid?
My Mom always said no one could get into heaven who had a tattoo.
That is the point. If they try to get across that positive yet false information about the wannabe gang member and thug Traydemark Martin, they open the door about what he was really like.
SD has a good post on that button….
…and I’m wondering why O’Mara didn’t take the bait when BDLR specifically brought Sybrina back on the stand to identify the button?
Racialized prosecutorial indiscretion in the Zimmerman case
Posted by William A. Jacobson Saturday, July 6, 2013 at 10:35am
http://legalinsurrection.com/2013/07/racialized-prosecutorial-indiscretion-in-the-zimmerman-case/
https://twitter.com/Nettles18/status/353589039804317696
Who is RT?
I’m asking tweeters to Re-Tweet (RT) to spread the word and hopefully add pressure.
The media has been silent on the fact that while the Martin family demanded a trial they refused to help bring the truth forward. Not giving a sample of Trayvon’s voice is suspicious to me. They know if they provide one, it will be clearer as to who was screaming.
Daaaaa…thanks
Nettles – in addition, the assinine Tracy Martin wouldn’t give up the pin # on TM’s cell phone which would have been on his bill just as my pin # is on my ATT internet bill & cell bill.
Tracy proved to be too much of a risk for the State to put on as a witness because he couldn’t withstand the cross exam from MOM/West. The State may call Tracy to use as a rebuttal witness, again claiming that was TM screaming. MOM stated at being surprised “some family members didn’t testify.” imo, so much emphasis has been put on the 911 call, someone from TM’s family will testify imo. If this should happen, Tracy wouldn’t be cross examined. Of course the Defense can call Tracy as their witness, if they don’t, imo, we’ll hear from him in the States rebuttal.
Definition of Prosecution Rebuttal: Rebuttal evidence is evidence that tends to explain, refute, counteract, or disprove …
That and the phone….they have nothing to hide!!!!!!!!!!
This is off topic but amazing to me. A passenger on a plane that crash landed in San Francisco has tweeted out a picture of being evacuated from the plane!
https://twitter.com/Eunner/status/353592664526028801
LOL
https://twitter.com/DoctorGooFee/status/353330144225673216
Cute but inaccurate because the argument would be that it was the other guy screaming your name to get you to stop hitting him. Why would you scream your own name after all?
They used to tell women to cry FIRE or BOMB instead of Rape or Murder because more people would be vested in something that could affect them. Most attacks happen with quickness and agility completely overtaking the victim by surprise so to scream at all would take some amount of staying aware. The fact that George was aware and conscious through all of it, doesn’t mean the rest of us would be that lucky if it was happening to us. Although I don’t think George was truly aware of the amount of danger he was in.
The pain from sudden injury doesn’t begin until some time after the event. If you have heard battle stories where men lost some body parts and were not aware of it.
Also, as badly as the injuries were downplayed by the medical personnel, the police, the investigators and the PA, it actually worked in George’s favor to believe and heal himself. Sometimes making something more of it, does more harm than good. I know a parent who actually ignores his crying toddler when he falls or scrapes his knee. The child surprisingly enough stops crying because he figures its probably not too bad and gets on with whatever he was doing.
Quick question, if I may. Where can I find transcript (assuming no audio available) of Tracy under oath (if at all) re: how Trayvon got to Sanford? Ty.
There is no audio but you will find the statement about what Tracy told the State’s investigators about how Trayvon got to Sanford and when on page 28/284 discovery dump issued by the State in June 2012. http://www.clickorlando.com/blob/view/-/15490330/data/1/-/kligxm/-/Zimmerman-documents.pdf
To get a full flavor of what the family was saying in late March/ early April 2012 to the State’s investigators and BDLR, see page 9 (Stephen the cousin’s statement). Page 28, a joint interview on March 26th by Tracy and Sybrina. Page 32 Brandy Green’s statement to Guy, BDLR and O’Steen on March 27th, Page 36 is Rachel Jeantel’s interview on April 2nd which indicates it was taped, Page 37 is Sybrina Fulton’s statement given the same day they interviewed Rachel in her home, Page 39 is the statement taken from Chad at school and you’ll note he contradicts his mom’s statement and finally page 40 is Tracy’s statement where he corrects the misinformation he and Sybrina gave a week earlier about the last day she saw Trayvon and when he went to Sanford.
If you are still looking is in the summaries from the first of second discovery drops. There was some discussion on it because Tracy had stated to SPD that he drove TM half way on Tuesday, but Sybrina had said it was a Wednesday. Then on the second interview with FDLE Tracy said it was definitely Tuesday, but did not amend to say that TM took the bus.
Ty for the corection. Is that correction from tracy in this file or another? Just checking.
Nettles, a huge ty.
So, basically, they likely had brandi pick up tray who swung at a bus driver and hid it. That is why stephans tweet as mr_4dat “you no tell me you swung on bus driver” is the date tray took the bus. He texted deedee “you shoulda been on da bus :)” that very same night.
But did he text stephan? I do. Only the defense knows…i wonder if that is why brandi had to meet tray in the first place. Unless that was planned and a coincidence tray did what he did.
Read booby’s testimony. He gave an UNSOLICITED statement of how he never saw Tray smoke Marijuana. Then there is this from the night before (tweeted by him in March 2012)
Coincidence? Also it’s ambiguous who got high that night, technically. It also reminds me of how Tracy told 911 on missing person’s call, unsolicited, how ‘responsible’ his nephew is.
This family had time to plan their story to Cover their you know whats. The q is did the lawyer help with this or did he come on board because of this and then took advantage of it? We’ll likely never know. I will say this. After mid march, these type of tweets seemed to have stopped.
You should also read the esquire article – it’s so hilariously pathetically fake “Boobie and Tray would play video games, talk about girls and sleep in the same bunk bed”. Then there is THIS. Good grief. B.S, meet reality.
Here is the link to the esquire article for those who haven’t seen it.
http://www.esquire.com/features/americans-2012/trayvon-martin-1212
Some samples of traybog disconnect I am seeing today AFTER the state has rested 1) wait until the state introduces GZ texts and emails 2) wait until the state introduces GPS data from Zimmermans ankle bracelet. 3) wait until the state presents the FDLE investigators finding.
That is not surprising at all. They either don’t have a clue as to how the judicial system works in this country, or they have decided to ignore it. How do you think Sharpton keeps on like the energizer bunny, race baiting every chance he gets. They could care less that he has been proven wrong over and over.
A few months ago Tawana Brawley was found working in VA. under a different name. The judge ordered her pay to be garnished until she pays the awards that a jury gave to the people she claimed falsely that raped her. She had never paid the first dime on those awards. I suspect she will now up and move to another state, and use yet a different name in order to escape those payments.
It has been interesting for me that some of the talk radio hosts have talked about the Zimmerman case. They have been in favor of Zimmerman. They open up their lines to callers, and 99% of the callers have been black males who have argued that George followed Martin when he was told not to. A black female yesterday screamed her brians out that a “child” had been shot and killed, and it doesn’t matter at all why George shot him, he was just a child. The black male callers have been almost 100% in favoring TM. One guy called and said that he had heard the evidence in the trial so far, and that yes he agreed that it favored the defense. Despite that he said that Zimmerman should still be charged with murder 2, and that if he was a juror he would definately vote to convict. A lawyer called in right after him and said that it was the previous caller who really scared him the most. He knows the evidence but would vote to convict GZ despite the evidence.
Any rationality or reasoning among the black population, even some who are highly educated, and are in fact lawyers, cannot go against the racial issue of their fellow bros. and the laws be damned.
Minpin- I don’t know if you have read about Critical Race Theory, but here is an interesting article about it.
http://whitegirlbleedalot.com/trayvon-jeantel-and-critical-race-theory-not-just-for-whack-jobs-anymore/
This is taught to kids is some schools, and becoming more prevalent, the white privilege movement that you see in some Universities around the country are a result. The main problem with it aside from the straight out racism of it, is that it is a zero sum game, it does not provide any solutions just an excuse/explanation for black racism and lack success in America and around the world. In a sense it is the polar opposite of the “white power”
This is good Bori, thanks for sharing. I’ve been sufficiently brainwashed in this at the Universities. One white Professor demanded activism from her students in that we should actually seek out minorities to educate them that there is racism against them. The tragedy is that blacks are dominating the culture with “Black children learn at church that it’s good to clap, speak loudly and be a bit raucous. But doing the same thing at school, where 72% of teachers are white and may be unfamiliar with such customs, will get them in trouble.”
And the stoic, discipline of monastic religious types, military types, Amish types, and the melancholy old cultural types depicted in movies like “Babette’s feast” is completely discredited by young people. Your child can no more say Winnie the Pooh, and someone smack them down with, “you mean Winnie the Shit don’t you?” The worst thing about Jantel and her generation is their inability to recognize the beauty in other cultures and learn from others. She makes her own morality, where its okay to lie under oath, yet feel guilt over all sorts of other things, and progs cry about what a beautiful higher form of morality this is, so there is no burden on the Jantel’s to join the rest of the world.
Oh, as I was talking about stoicity and discipline, this is exactly why I put the picture of the police dogs looking at the little kitten go by, on my blog. Its the kind of mental discipline that George showed, right down to when he used swear words.
It was easy to recognize the resignation in his words, if you’ve been around that sort of discipline, yet people presume a hateful angry racist in combat boots, jumping out of the truck with gun at the ready. Manolo too, expected some expressive emotion from George, very surprisingly since Asians do understand quiet mental discipline, but he didn’t understand George’s
I like the taunts that the judge isn’t going to let Trayvon’s drug use, fights, gun in so there ha, ha, ha. They believe justice will be served by hiding the truth.
I bet the traynuts had a lovely weekend doxing GZ uncle looking for dirt
No doubt. I expect they’ll be insulting and belittling him soon if they haven’t already started.
Trent is lurking at the Zimmerman trial and has made some overt threats on his twitter tsaw33
Geesh, the guy is an obsessed stalker. Seriously. Who else does something like that?
It’s like he’s casing the courthouse for his followers… and zooming in on the address and stating “This is where your life ends.”
These folks aren’t gonna be satisfied until someone else is dead…
After Jorge Meza testified, did you note that Kelly Simms was between the doors? Is Shellie Zimmerman the next witness?
From what you are saying, it may be possible that Shellie may be the next witness. Personally I would put Shellie on the stand at the end to make an impact on the jury with that last testimony.
It should have been obvious to all that on the first day when BDLR argued to have them removed from the courtroom it had much more to do with the optics than anything else. Would the jurors see that George had no family members in the courtroom to support him, therefore even his family didn’t support his actions? We know that BDLR and Corey are playing the evil card everywhere they possibly can. It also added to the media optics as they focused heavily on Tracy and Sybrina each and every day. What they were wearing, what expressions they made. Who was sitting by the Martin family members such as Corey. GZ’s family was not there, and consequently were never mentioned.
I would put Tracy Martin along with Serino and the other two witnesses to the “not my son” fiasco last
https://twitter.com/VP_JFGZ/status/353666101437145091
Right. That’s the video where Crump feeds that to her. I was just watching that earlier today. I am trying to compile a list of this in an easy to digest format. If anybody has any suggestions…
Not sure what trial Jonathan “tinfoil hat” Capehart was watching
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/post-partisan/wp/2013/07/05/prosecution-rests-case-against-george-zimmerman/
The comments on this article are great!
People are pushing back on Capehart and others.
I just sent an email to Zorn about his latest article, he’s gets it right on the important stuff.
http://blogs.chicagotribune.com/news_columnists_ezorn/2013/07/20.html
20 things I think about the George Zimmerman case
Zorn and I are seeing pretty much eye to eye on everything. Of the hundreds of posts I’ve written, they are all very similar.
I do think Zorn’s initial criticism of George was a little unfair, as it was a bit of a lose-lose question by Hannity about the regrets. If he said how much he regretted his decision to use deadly force, it would definitely have been used against him by the Trayvonites. In fact considering how ridiculously terrible their case it, it probably would have been their top piece of evidence against him.
But I also didn’t particularly care for George’s answer either.
The other accounts of George’s regrets during the police interview and by witnesses after the event, I was able to give him the benefit of the doubt,
Agreed, it was very awkward but not hard to understand given the choices under the intense circumstances of that interview. GZ was desperate to show that he was not a racist monster and needed donations.
I read your posts at TL, and naturally find your perspective sane and reasoned. I am disgusted at the unwillingness of so many to put themselves in the place of being attacked as GZ was. Talkleft has a core group of such unreasonable righteous lefties.
GZ does not regret saving himself from death or serious brain injury. He knows he is responsible for killing TM, he did the unspeakable because no one stopped TM. Unlike Zorn I very much believe GZ that TM said ‘your gonna die tonight MoFo” I also believe TM said ” you got a problem” when he first contacted George. I have heard those exact phrases in my hood, in fact, one of my neighbors a middle age woman was threatened with that same statement after testifying in court against a family of drug dealers. “You got a problem” is standard hood talk to any white person who happens to do a double take on teens with an attitude. This incident was not a fight, it was a battery by TM.
I do not believe GZ exaggerated anything that night when interviewed other than the number of blows to the head, my son did the same when he was attacked. Some of the blows are not as damaging as others, the beating blurs your thinking as time stands still, you wonder when the attack will stop, you think you are going to go unconscious, GZ could not even protect his face since his arms were pinned down.
I think Zorn and Merritt are way too soft on TM, and way too soft on the brutality of thug culture, good lefties preserving their status.
On the matter of “it was God’s plan”, if you are a believer and accept that nature is God’s creation and you understand the body’s natural response to fear is fight or flight, than explaining the instinct to take profound action to protect your life is God’s plan. Of course he regretted that TM died from the gunshot, he intended to stop TM not kill him as he was trained to do. Early on when GZ family felt they could they tried to express sorrow. As Robert jr has explained GZ become a very somber person right after the incident, but he does not regret defending his life. GZ is in a impossible situation of damned if he does damned if he doesn’t. It is too easy for journalist and pundits to second guess GZ, after all he is just a doofus as Zorn tells us, not a 26 year old who has been placed on the altar of black rage and retribution.
Mark O’Mara is profiled here:
http://www.cbs12.com/news/top-stories/stories/vid_8594.shtml
Who is going to order an investigation into what Crump did in hiding Rachel Jeantel until he got the 911 tapes released?
Nettles – sadly, I don’t think anything is going to happen to Crump, imo, it was witness tampering at the least. I read an article last week in which a DA blatantly filed fraudulent subpoenas, lied, & set up a defendant in order to get a conviction. The DA ONLY lost his license to practice law for 180 days, or 6 months. Hardly a consequence.
Baez was supposed to be brought up on sanctions after KC’s case, & nothing ever materialized, I could never figure out WHY he didn’t suffer any consequences. Bill Sheaffer cleared that up last week, he stated, “if GZ is found NOT GUILTY, the sanctions will go away just as they did for Baez.” That isn’t a remedy for the injustices, but it did happen in KC’s case. imo, Corey/BDLR both need to retire. Sadly too, they have endlessly been accused of the same behavior for years & nothing ever happened to them, no repercussions, imo, they are too politically connected. This is not the first time Corey/BDLR have been accused of the very same behavior, I read several grievances defendants have claimed in the past, but Corey/BDLR have skated every time.
I find it absolutely bizarre how many Trayvon worshippers are still clinging to the “Trayvon never touched GZ” and “Gz injured himself” meme
those people are idiots.
Now back to a point made by a tweeter. Yes it is true, GZ never said that TM said “what are you following me for”. It was Crump who said that. GZ said that TM said “Do you have a problem?” and GZ said “No” and TM said “you do now” and then he punched GZ in the face.
I honestly believe that is what actually took place. I do not believe Rachel Jeantel. I think she was given a script of what to say. She might have been on the phone but not at the time of the assault. She is lying about the assault on George Zimmerman.
She may have also not been on the phone with Tray or he lied to her. The only way to construct a logical conclusion is to look at all of his texts with her and get a profile of if he wanted to impress her or not. Technically, I say *yes* because of 2-21-12 “You shoulda been on da bus :)” which is when I think he tried to assault the driver.
If you look at all texts re: fights etc, I wonder if he was trying to impress one person in particular. It makes sense for so many reasons. And it may be why Rachel feels guilt. She may not even have needed a script, just a little ‘assistance’ as she creates her own b.s. to feed her guilt. It may be why she is also such a heavy drinker.
Exactly. Why did she have guilt?
Also, is she involved in a gang?
Trayvon was a definite gang wannabe, so how did he meet Rachel? Is she a gang chick? Did he see her as an easy lay?
I think she was on the phone at the time that TM punched GZ in the nose. I think that is when the phone hung up and she heard nothing after she heard TM say “Well you got a problem now!” ….. and she thought it was just a fight.
Rachel’s phone records say her call ended at 7:15:43 and 28 seconds later Jenna Lauer (W11) called 911 and we hear GZ’s screams in the background.
I believe Crump knew about Rachel on March 1st or 2nd and I think she didn’t attend his funeral b/c she was freaked out to hear he died a minute after her call ended. Rachel said her friend texted her an article on Tuesday, Feb. 29th that showed her proof Trayvon had died and she asked them what time did he die and she checked her records and learned she was the last one. I think that’s a lie. The times of the calls were not reported so her friend could not have told her what time the article said Trayvon died. Nope, it was Crump who told her.
This is why Crump filed to get those calls released. He needed them to help craft Rachel narrative on what was said on the phone.
Rachel was on the phone with Trayvon when he circled George’s car and she knows that happened and she knows what Travyon said. GZ didn’t hear what he said, he rolled up the window and continued to talk to Sean.
The parents of Trayvon Martin knew the truth of what happened in the early days in talking with Rachel but they destroyed George Zimmerman’s life and made his family live in hiding and fear for over 16 months. While it’s sad they lost their child, there is no excuse for them to knowingly spread lies so that they can gain financially.
I’m looking forward to the truth being told.
This is a great post but something is throwing a red flag at me. You mention she said she was told on the 29th. I had the impression she stated (not sure how) she found out the next day at school. I probably imagined that and confused what happened on Twitter when friends found out the next day (all saying it was a fight – odd). Even the ‘girlfriend’ of Trayvon, whose name I won’t give but was featured in an arcile you will find on his site if you search ‘who dat?’.
Man, this defense needs to fly you first class to their courtroom.
Your memory is good. She did say she found out the next day. She said that to Crump in the March 19th interview in clip 6 she says:
Clip 6: Source:
http://www.gzdocs.com/documents/0113/w8_interview/w8_recordingA6_red.mp3 – (1 minute, 55 seconds)
W8: Yeah, you could say that.
Crump: OK, Well, I think that’s everything. Uh, I, I want to say on behalf of his mom and daddy and his family it means so much you sharing to us what you all talked about the last time that he was alive. You were, the records confirm that you were the last person to talk to him alive and that you heard part of the altercation between what happened just minutes before he was killed.
W8: Yeah
Crump: Okay. And so, we are keeping you in our prayers. And when you talk to your mother, if at any point, uh, you know after a little while, where you say you uh, come on and we, your face will be grayed out and stuff, it’s one thing to hear it’s another thing to just see any kind of image uh, and you tell that story just like you told us earlier today which just put it in perspective for us. He was just trying to get home uh, and it started raining. Is that pretty,
W8: Yeah.
Crump: that’s pretty accurate?
W8: Yeah.
Crump: Okay. Um, Well, thank you so much and tell your mother thank you and uh Sybrina, uh Mr. Martin uh, well his mom and dad, they’ll call next week. Oh, I did want to say this. Um, I understand that you can’t come to the wake because you had to go to the hospital. Can you tell me about that?
W8: He didn’t call back so I thought, okay, he done knocked the phone on the grass, cause I thought it was a fight. And then, and then the next day
Abrupt End to Clip 6 =========================================
But on the stand, during cross-examination she said she heard rumors at school on Monday and didn’t believe them and then on Tuesday a friend texted her an article.
I am so looking forward to the time line expert lay this out for the jury.
The critical point is when the phone went dead. What I am also getting at is the extra information provided by Rachel and she could not have heard anything. It was stuff that strains credulty.
Can we really know if she heard any words? Or did she change the words that she heard to the ones that Crump told her to say? Now that is a serious question!!!
I’ll remind you that after she heard a bump, in the March 19th interview she never heard anything after that. “The phone just shut-off” In BDLR’s interview she says the same thing but BDLR pushes for more. So she says might have heard a little get off.
In her interview with BDLR we hear her say “Trayvon bum…somebody bumped Trayvon” See 11:28 mark
Yes Nettles, that is exactly what I am referring to. She never heard those things because the phone was shut off.
Also, she first said that Trayvon bumped, then changed it to the other person bumped Trayvon.
It was the fact that BDLR pushed for further information and she went further, after the phone had shut off, that has me not believing her story.
Just beyond that point she said she couldn’t hear Trayvon. West played the part in court and asked her what she was saying. She grabbed at her bangs and put her hand over her face. She was busted. But then a recess got called, she left the stand for the break and when she came back she changed it to she could hear Trayvon say get off. Someone coached her during the recess I think.
You are keeping a better eye on the actual trial. I did not know there had been the recess. Yes, I believe she was coached during that time by (Crump, Vereen on behalf of Crump?) or perhaps by BDLR. It does not matter who did the coaching because she was coming off as being coached. The same with the overnight thing. She came back with a different attitude.
I am waiting now to see if West recalls her to the stand. She has a lot more to tell.
How come this is not the face of the woman who took the stand? Is this the face of someone who was first thought to be “DD”?
I thought the DD in court had an “interesting” body type – when exiting the court room you could see she was somewhat wide from the waist down, but she seemed rather tall, so that may have been proportionate. But her chest, face, and rather large neck were so out of proportion. In other words, her over-weight seemed to mainly be from the waist up, not a general all-body obesity.
I agree with those who think she started adding on “things she heard” – but if there *were* a “little get off, get off”, it certainly sounds like something GZ would say after being punched and then pushed around as TM tried to get him down for the ground and pound.
I would love it if MOM found the busdriver. I so want those scheming parents to be exposed. They isn’t a place in h*ll for someone who tries to put an innocent man in jail, exposes his family to threats and disrupts their whole lives, and bears responsibility for all the innocent white people who have been attacked by gangs of blacks as “justice for Trayvon”. THey can get away with a lot – they’re grieving, it was their “opinion” it was TM’s voice, etc – but if they can get them on the coverup of the fighting hx, lying on the stand, etc, maybe they can get in trouble.
Same here. I can’t wait for the truth to be told either. I can’t imagine that the defense’s timeline won’t account for pretty much every second of George’s whereabouts via the call records so that there is NO DOUBT in the jurors’ minds that George is telling the truth and that his few inconsistencies are not lies.
Though, I do worry that there is someone like this on the jury.
http://frontpagemag.com/2013/david-horowitz/is-the-zimmerman-case-really-open-and-shut/
Pretty innocuous.
1) the “God’s plan” was not GZ finest moment. But as I already noted above, it was a lose/lose question.
2) I disagree completely that Trayvon “deserved to die”. I think approx 10-15% of the hardcore GZ supporters may think this. If Horowitz wants to make the point TM didn’t deserve to die, I don’t particularly mind.
Many conservatives would rather not pick this fight, that’s for sure. Ex Fox News. It’s not good for the status quo.
Horowitz is wrong on the insignificant injuries and the defense is likely to put medical information about head trauma forward.
Horowitz is late to the game and missing plenty of evidence is drawing his conclusion.
Agreed, 100%.
When Sybrina said her little thug was in heaven i would have said “objection…calls for speculation”…..but then again…im kind of an asshole LOL
This made me laugh! ♥
Global grind has a poll who is more credible Sybrina or Gladys http://globalgrind.com/news/sybrina-fulton-gladys-zimmerman-son-911-call-help-george-trial-trayvon-martin-mother-video-poll
Come on guys!!! There’s still work to do!
This is hilarious! I love it all, but for some reason the part where MOM turns his head toward George you see him bob his head side to side. LOL
George Zimmerman, Hollow Points and Reality – Mike McDaniel Post
http://statelymcdanielmanor.wordpress.com/2013/07/06/george-zimmerman-hollow-points-and-reality/
http://patdollard.com/2013/06/bombshell-crime-zimmerman-prosecutor-caught-suborning-perjury-transcript-of-deposition-suggest-zimmerman-prosecutors-fed-phony-story-to-trayvon-girlfriend/
This is the transcript I’m talking about. At 2:10 of this video, Mr. West gets into it with her. She clearly said she couldn’t hear Trayvon. On the stand she said, that’s why I was calling his name, Trayvon, Trayvon. The judge wouldn’t allow it to be played in front of the jury and she dismissed them right before the 2:10 mark. Shawn’s cues it up at 2:11:20…what do you think she said? Could she hear Trayvon or she couldn’t hear Trayvon.
How is it legal for the judge to keep allowing her to avoid perjury? Will the defense use this for their appeal?
I cannot see why people are not making a bigger deal of this.
I think she was saying I coulda heard Trayvon, as if not totally and then quickly became sure it was Trayvon.
Hummmm..